Mr. Donall O'Keeffe:

I will take on two points Deputy O'Donovan raised, one on engagement with brewers and the role of brewers within the pub sector. I would make a number of points in that regard. Clearly, it is a highly profitable industry in Ireland - there is no debate about that. In fairness to the brewers, they have suffered the same volume declines as we have. The on trade in Ireland is 35% smaller than it was in 2007 and they are under fairly serious financial pressure to manage smaller volumes. Within that, there have been redundancies in most of the brewing groups in Ireland. We recognise that there has been only one brewers' increase since 2008. We are now on the cusp of 2015 and they have shown a large degree of price restraint.

The other thing that is positive for us in the medium term looking forward is the emergence of the craft beer sector. We are seeing the market fragment a great deal and seeing consumers looking for different things. That increases competition between large brewers and craft brewers and among publicans. That is in the consumer's interest and in the industry's interest. It will be good for us in the longer term.

The final point to make - and we have our scars from the High Court on it - is that from a trade association point of view, we are prohibited from engaging in price discussions with the brewers. It always occurs at individual pub level. One of the realities of the structure in Ireland is that one has three or four large brewers with an enormous market share dealing with 8,000 publicans, each of whom has a tiny market share. The emergence of craft in particular will be good for us in terms of greater competition, which is what suits everyone best. Ultimately, it suits the customer best.

The second point on the pub trade being demonised and the image of the pub sector as the source of a lot of problems is one in respect of which I would make a couple of points. First, I have ten years' experience representing publicans and there has been a dramatic change in how the industry is viewed by media, politicians and consumers over those ten years. Ten years ago, the drinks industry was about the pub trade full stop. Nobody saw any other actors in it or paid attention to any other players in the sector. Today, there is a clear recognition that there are three parties at play in the drinks industry in Ireland. There is the supply sector including the large brewers and distillers who are an integral part of the industry. We see a lot of attention politically and media-wise on those for their marketing practices in particular. Over the space of a decade and emerging from nowhere really, the multiple retailers have become huge players in the drinks industry. There is also a large, well-established traditional pub sector. It is my view that most of the media, political and genuine public concern today is around the role of multiple retailers. If one talks to parents or the public or does consumer research, as we do, it appears time and again that cheap alcohol from the multiple retailers is the source of a great deal of concern around underage drinking and associated public order problems from access to cheap alcohol.

We think that is a failure of regulation. The abolition of the groceries order was a disaster as is the liberalisation of the off-licence regime. A hard-hitting, strict and firm regulatory approach is required to the sale of alcohol in the multiple retail sector in particular. We have called repeatedly for the introduction of a minimum unit price and structural separation for the mandatory codes around the merchandising of alcohol and a ban on price-based promotion. Those are regulatory initiatives that need to be taken by the Government to establish a greater degree of control.