Ms Emily Logan:

I hope the Senator will forgive me for involving her in some of the quasi-executive issues but, to be frank, while people have been discussing the merger of two institutions, my observation is that the commission is almost like a start-up. There were only 12 staff at the commission when I was nominated in July, whereas we now have 22. Our expectation is that we will have an agreed ceiling of 47. The Senator is correct: there are two different cultures. Having met both sets of staff, I am aware that they are very keen to advance and become the staff of the new Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission. I do not want to pretend that the past did not happen. I was surprised when I met some of the staff, particularly those from the Equality Authority, and discovered how demoralised they felt as a result of events in recent years. I take this opportunity to pay tribute to the resilience of the staff who stayed with the Equality Authority and who have agreed to transfer to the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission. The reality is that I have joined an organisation which needs to be uplifted and given a sense of vision, future, working together and pride. The staff are very proud of the work they did within both institutions. However, it has been a difficult few years and I have no wish to deny that.

In terms of bringing together conceptually the cultures of human rights and equality, the latter has traditionally been articulated as a negative obligation in the sense that it is the State's duty not to discriminate against particular groups. The positive duty allows an interaction between public bodies, in particular, and the commission. In my previous role as Ombudsman for Children, I gained experience in trying to encourage people. The word "encourage" is used on a number of occasions in section 10 of the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission Act 2014. On the basis of the well-established foundations the Irish Human Rights Commission and the Equality Authority have already laid, I would like to develop a really positive relationship with public bodies with regard to trying to bring them with us in the context of the human rights and equality agenda in order to ensure that when citizens interact with them, their experience will be one of being treated with humanity and dignity.

I just want to be frank and inform the committee that we have a great deal of work to do. We do not have as many staff as we need and there is much recruitment to be done. We will be moving to a new premises that will include staff offices and also a participation space. The building will have a street frontage and will be accessible to the public. We will invite groups in and interact directly with rights holders. The commission will be both active and interactive. It is fair to state that Senator Zappone recognises that it has not been an easy time for anybody who has served with either of the bodies prior to the establishment of the new commission. However, the people who are with me now want to stay and are very committed to working for the new Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission.