Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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On behalf of the committee I warmly welcome a cross-party, cross-jurisdiction and cross-competency grouping of people, the A5 working group. I welcome Daniel McSorley, chief executive of Omagh District Council and Strabane District Council. I wish to acknowledge his role in putting the project together and initiating the process. I welcome Alderman Michael Coyle, chairman, and Ms Anne McNaught, project officer, of the north west region cross-Border group, and Mr. John McLaughlin, director of services at Donegal County Council. I welcome the newly elected cathaoirleach of Donegal County Council, Councillor John Campbell. It is nice to have the first citizen of Donegal in Dublin today. I welcome Eugene Cummins, chief executive of Monaghan County Council. I understand he is new in the job and I wish him well in his new role. I welcome Councillor Dan Kelly, chairman of Strabane District Council, and congratulate him on his elevation to the position of chairman. I also welcome Councillor Seán Conlon from Monaghan County Council. To avoid confusion, Deputy Sean Conlan sends his apologies.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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Since he is not here we can get a go at him over this road.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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Anyway, he sends apologies. Obviously he would prefer to be here, but he cannot be. I welcome Elizabeth Harkin, public relations officer at Omagh District Council, and I wish to acknowledge her work and her role behind the scenes in her day-to-day job as well as her day-to-day facilitation of this process.

Regional development in the Border areas is vital to ensuring long-term economic benefits for the island as a whole. Today we will be discussing in particular the A5 road project and the potential avenues to progress the project and keep it live and on the minds of the people who are in a position to move it forward.

Before I invite the witnesses to make their presentation, I advise them that they are protected by absolute privilege in respect of utterances. However, if they are directed by the committee to cease making remarks on a particular matter and they continue to do so, they are entitled thereafter only to a qualified privilege. They are directed that only comments in respect of the subject matter of this meeting are to be given and they are asked to respect the parliamentary practice to the effect that, where possible, they should not criticise or make charges against a Member of either Houses of the Oireachtas, a person outside the Houses or an official by name or in such a way as to make him or her identifiable.

Without further ado, I call on the cathaoirleach of Donegal County Council, Councillor John Campbell, to proceed with his opening remarks.

Mr. John Campbell:

I thank the committee for receiving our delegation and allowing us to update the committee on the project we are here to discuss - that is, the N14-A5-N2 route. We call it the Dublin to Derry and Donegal route. I remind the committee that we met in September 2012, when the delegation outlined the importance of developing the dual carriageway as a key strategic route from Dublin to the north west. We highlighted the need to ensure connectivity between the main cities throughout the country and identified gateways and hubs in the peripheral regions. We have come before the committee today to reaffirm the need to have the A5 dual carriageway project kept at the top of the agenda in both jurisdictions and to continue the planning for the implementation of the project in its entirety. I will reflect on some of the progress over the past 20 years as well as the context - that is, where we see the project fitting within the Good Friday Agreement and other regional strategies. Then I will hand over to my colleague, Danny Kelly, from Strabane. He will go into a more in-depth discussion on the A5 route and why we see it as a continued priority. He will then sum up what we are asking of the joint committee.

We should consider this broadly in the context of the Good Friday Agreement. I realise I am talking to people who are altogether aware of this; I am not trying to teach my granny to suck eggs but simply to set the context. We have seen major achievements in cross-Border co-operation and collaborative work in the past 20 years, especially in the areas of health, transport, airports, tourism, waterways, and third level education.

The Good Friday Agreement brought a new beginning to Ireland, North and South, to the Governments, the communities and individuals. It focused on connecting people and communities and removing barriers to building peace, prosperity, development and growth, especially in the society and communities North and South in the Border region. It brought a new beginning to relationships on the island of Ireland and to our expectations for a new beginning for everyone no matter where they live. This idea is especially dear to us in the region we are discussing.

To build new relationships we must remove the blockages to economic and social progress. We have identified that the delivery of the N14-A5-N2 route to the north west would help to overcome some of the barriers that the Good Friday Agreement brought to light. Furthermore, we believe it would help us to achieve, facilitate and make easier a range of projects and initiatives, under programmes such as INTERREG and PEACE. We believe it will enhance the results considered to be achievable under those programmes, and this is a key aspect for the areas that we represent.

There is a need to build on the goodwill generated by the agreements, to strengthen the links between the communities on both sides of the Border and to overcome the obstacles to access to each other and the wider community on the island. It is a question of equality of opportunity.

The Good Friday Agreement refers to the right to equal opportunity in all social and economic activity. The strategic transport planning is identified in the agreement as an area of North-South co-operation and for discussion by the British-Irish Council. In respect of that, a section of the A5 has been identified but in isolation that does not work for our location. The connection on sections of the N2 and N14 through Letterkenny to Dublin has been essential to allow the region grow and maybe help to offset the deprivation, unemployment and other factors that afflict or affect us in the north-west region, no matter which side of the Border one lives on.

There is a commitment in the agreement to policies for sustained economic growth and stability in Northern Ireland and to promoting social inclusion. Transport links were identified as a suitable issue for discussion at the British–Irish Council as outlined in Strand 3 of the Good Friday Agreement. It also recognises the importance of ensuring equality of opportunity and includes a commitment to policies for sustained economic growth and stability in Northern Ireland and to promoting social inclusion. The implementation of these policies included a new regional development strategy which would lead to social cohesion in the rural and Border areas as well as urban settings. The strategy would commit to making rapid progress and strengthening the physical infrastructure of the region, developing the advantages and resources of rural areas and rejuvenating major urban centres. That is part of the focus of our discussion today.

This project sits well with the regional development strategy, the national development plan and the north-west gateway initiative and the St. Andrews Agreement, which further committed to ensure the executive has the capacity to make long-term capital investments to underpin the economic transformation of Northern Ireland, as well as bringing long-term benefits to the island. The development of the A5 dual carriageway and the N14-N2 link is essential to improve connectivity to the north west and to create a peace dividend, particularly in areas that suffered social exclusion, chronic unemployment and deprivation, the areas we represent and which our respective councils fall into. A failure to honour the commitment risks creating conditions which would have the potential to resurrect feelings of discontent and disenfranchisement in communities.

The National Development Plan 2007-2013 recognised Letterkenny-Derry as a gateway critical to the economic and tourist development of the north west and the Government has committed to pursuing opportunities to underpin development of this gateway, highlighting the improvements in road links to the region as among the priorities. It ties in especially with tourism on the wild Atlantic way and the north Antrim coast. Allowing one to hop on and hop off those routes, whether entering them at the M1 and returning that way, or travelling through Donegal and along the west coast, would help enhance those opportunities.

The regional development strategy recognises the need for balanced regional development in order to achieve social cohesion and build a strong regional economy. The strategy specifies Omagh and Strabane as hubs, centres of employment and services for the surrounding rural communities. A major part of that is having a strategic road network, bringing the project we are discussing to fruition.

The absence of access routes is very obvious in the north west. The route into the north west is especially important to open up different economic and tourism opportunities.

Mr. Dan Kelly:

I thank the committee for the opportunity to address it again today.

The A5 forms part of the strategic road network between Derry, Donegal and Dublin. It is one of the main arteries for the Northern Ireland economy, linking towns, cities, air and sea ports and its development would help boost industry and commerce as well as facilitating tourist travel. It remains, however, a single carriageway unfit for purpose and operating significantly beyond capacity. The A5 western transport corridor project aims to develop 86 km of dual carriageway from Aughnacloy on the Tyrone-Monaghan border to New Buildings just outside Derry.

An agreement was reached between the two Governments that the project would be joint funded with approximately £400 million coming from each. After our last meeting with the committee in 2012 the Minister for Regional Development went on to issue the direction and vesting orders for two sections of the route, from New Buildings to north of Strabane and from south Omagh to Ballygawley. In the interim, however, opponents of the A5 dual carriageway project sought a judicial review of the decision to proceed with the project entering 12 challenges. The judge quashed 11 of these challenges but upheld the twelfth, relating to appropriate environmental assessments.

The implementation of the A5 project has been delayed while the Department for Regional Development resolves the technical issue raised by the judicial challenge. Four reports have been developed to assess any impacts and all designated environmentally sensitive sites, of which there are nine, in the vicinity of the scheme and, where appropriate, to introduce mitigation measures. The reports indicate that with proposed mitigations the scheme will not have an impact on the functional habitat in its vicinity. It is not an environmental challenge that is being made, it is a question of procedure around the technicalities.

A public consultation exercise on three of these reports commenced on 30 April of this year and concluded on 13 June. The Department has received several representations which are being considered. The fourth report on the Tully bog special area of conservation is not finished because the study is being carried out over the summer. It is expected it will be published for public consultation by the end of the summer.

The Department of Regional Development in the North is also reviewing the environmental statement for the full length of the scheme from New Buildings to Aughnacloy, as well as the draft vesting and direction orders, and it is envisaged that the updated environmental statement, together with the draft direction and vesting orders, will be published for comment at the end of this year. A public exhibition is also likely and should coincide with these publications. The need for any further public inquiry will then be determined following careful consideration of the representations and any level of objection received in response to the public consultations.

It would seem that a public inquiry, if deemed necessary, would take place towards late spring or early summer of next year.

The next slide deals with why the Dublin-Derry-Donegal route is a priority. I hope I am preaching to the converted. The north-west region of Ireland, with a population of approximately 500,000, needs to be connected to the strategic road network. That is fundamental. I am not one to boast, but there is a wealth of latent potential in the region - including its people, business, economy, tourism and culture - which could be brought to fruition given the proper infrastructure.

As Councillor Campbell has outlined, the region as a whole is entirely served by single carriageway rural roads making journey times unpredictable, but predictably slow. Journey time certainty would make the region more attractive to inward investment, dramatically improving economic performance and growth to bring the region into line with the rest of the country. Economic productivity in the north west lags behind the national average. There is a lower share of high value economic sectors and a greater dependence on manufacturing and construction jobs in the region, which has been badly impacted by the economic downturn.

Derry, the North's second largest city - and the fourth largest city on the island - is not served by the motorway network link. There is no real link into the north west except for the single line connection between Derry and Belfast. As members of the committee will be aware, the air link between Derry and Dublin has recently been terminated.

I do not need to remind the committee of the high levels of deprivation and unemployment that can afflict the region. Moving to slide No. 10, statistics for this year show that Derry has the highest, and Strabane the second highest, claimant rates in Northern Ireland at 8.2% and 7.3% respectively. The Northern Ireland average is 4.7%. Derry and Strabane also suffer from some of the highest unemployment rates in the North, significantly above the 2013 average of 29.5%. At 34.2%, Derry is the second highest, while Strabane is the fifth highest with a rate of 30.2%.

Across the Border the situation is no different. Donegal has consistently demonstrated some of the highest levels of unemployment. According to the 2011 census, Donegal had an unemployment rate of 26.2% which is the highest in the country - a position it has maintained since 2006. It is worth noting that the State's unemployment figure is 19%. It is still too high, but is considerably less than the north west. The results of the 2011 census, reported in July 2012, also show that Donegal has a youth employment rate of 49% which is second only to Limerick.

The historic deficit in strategic road investment in the region must be addressed in terms of equality for the north-west. The A5 route currently operates significantly above capacity for a single carriageway, with daily traffic volumes more appropriate for a dual carriageway. There are currently just under 1,400 private access junctions along the existing A5 with the implications that has for road safety. I do not need to remind the committee that collision rates on rural two-lane roads are more than double those on dual carriageways. We have had a significant number of deaths in collisions on those routes in recent times.

As regards access to services, communities living in the north west have to travel greater distances to key services such as hospitals, life-saving services provided by acute hospitals, and medical centres of excellence. People throughout the north west have to travel significantly longer distances to access these services in Dublin and Belfast. As members of the committee will be aware, these impact on the golden hour during which these people need to be treated.

Young people and students have to travel to access educational establishments and training facilities to enable them to compete on an equal basis for employment opportunities. This is exacerbated by the poor roads network and a lack of access to public transport. The A5's links to the N2 and N14 are essential to ensure connectivity and equality of opportunity for these communities.

Moving to the next slide, I will discuss why the development of road infrastructure continues to be a priority in terms of opportunities and costs. The development of a linkage from the north west to the motorway network will undoubtedly have long-term consequences for the region and its communities in improving economic development, promoting the tourism industry, and the ability to attract foreign direct investment, as well as supporting home-grown indigenous business and enterprises.

Tourism is a major growth industry particularly in rural areas. Reliable and safe access routes into the north west are vital to ensure that the potential of the region is accessed and maximised. The delivery of the Derry-Donegal-Dublin strategic route is vital to maximise the benefit of European funding and to build the prosperity of the region, which will build and consolidate the peace.

For example, the A5 scheme's detailed appraisal confirms its economic worth, including an estimate of 260 permanent new jobs and €180 million in wider business efficiencies. Those figures have been superseded by a report in 2013 that was requisitioned by the UK Business Secretary in London.

The progression of this vision for roads infrastructure will greatly boost the construction industry, which is one of the key employment sectors on this island. As well as being a positive boost to the sector it would also reduce the cost to the Government in terms of employment and other social benefits.

I am getting to the nub of the question of why we are here again today and what we are asking the committee to do. In essence, we are asking members of the committee to become champions for the project. The completion of the A5 dual-carriageway is part of the outworking of the Good Friday Agreement. We are here to ask the joint committee's members to become champions of the project. We want them to advocate the A5 as a strategic priority with the Government, the Northern Ireland Executive, the British Government, the North-South Ministerial Council and the British-Irish Council.

We ask members of the joint committee to use their influence, both individually and collectively, to ensure that construction of the dual-carriageway connection to the north west is government policy in both jurisdictions and that it remains a key strategic priority for the committee in future.

We also ask the joint committee to urge the North-South Ministerial Council to use the window of opportunity in the next 12 to 15 months to develop a sound funding and implementation plan for the project in its entirety. Indeed, we ask the committee to ensure that the A5 dual-carriageway project, and the phased development of the N2 and N14, are included in the next comprehensive spending review for the Northern Ireland Executive and in the next capital expenditure programme of the Irish Government. We further ask that the Dublin-Derry-Donegal strategic route is included in any recovery programme being developed.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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Both contributions were fairly comprehensive. I will open up the debate for the members now, starting with Deputy Brendan Smith.

Brendan Smith (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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Like you, Chairman, I welcome the delegation's contributions on this important subject. They have followed the high standard of presentations that were made in 2012 by the local authorities involved. The map of areas that are disadvantaged by not having good arterial routes covers an extremely large part of our national population. On the last occasion, Mr. Séamus Neely, gave a particular figure on the population of that area which was very high. Mr. McLoughlin mentioned the word "connectivity" which is so important in the context of regional economic development.

Deputy Seán Conlan and Councillor Eugene Cummins, along with our council colleagues in Monaghan, are very supportive of this project, as I am. As a representative of Cavan-Monaghan I will continue to support this necessary project which will bring big benefits to a large part of our island. We need to get it progressed as soon as possible. We have seen the advantages and importance of major road developments throughout the country. It goes without saying that I am glad to support the project.

Some months ago, Deputy McHugh, myself and some other members of the committee had meetings in Donegal and Derry on various aspects of economic, social and educational development. At each meeting the A5 issue arose, quite understandably, and valid points were made on the need to progress the project.

The economic returns will be very beneficial for the country.

I understood substantial funding had been earmarked under the Northern Ireland expenditure programme. My information may not be up to date but I later heard this funding was to be reallocated to other areas of public expenditure north of the Border. Has the position on this been clarified or am I incorrect? My colleague, Deputy Charlie McConalogue, has gone to another meeting but wanted to state that he fully supports the initiative, along with Deputies McHugh and Pringle, who are also from County Donegal. This project must be developed and the presentation today was important. Every forum available to the witnesses, at official and political level, must be used by them to ensure this stays on the agenda because it is a matter that should be progressed at an early date.

Mr. Pat Doherty MP:

I welcome the chairmen from Donegal and Strabane, along with the rest of the delegation. I think this presentation may be unique because everyone in the room is in agreement. We all want this to happen.
Councillor John Campbellwas correct that this began with the St. Andrews Agreement but the mechanism for progress is the North-South Ministerial Council and that is where we must focus our attention for practical implementation. There are two Johns here from Donegal so I will ask them both the following question. What has been the response of the Irish Government to its commitment to complete the N14 connection with the A5, south of Strabane and Letterkenny? We are very aware of what is happening with the A5, including the court case and the fact that 11 of the 12 points made against the A5 were thrown out. One point was upheld and there is a new timescale for the road. We must go through the various procedures and the programme has been laid out but I wonder whether each stage must take so long.
Regarding the section of road from Ballygawley to Aughnacloy, I am worried by the fact that there is not a programme to lay out the draft vesting and direction orders in the North. The reason given is uncertainty as to where the N2 will make the connection so clarity on this would be welcome. The delegates from County Monaghan might know more on this. Where will the N2 meet the A5? If this is not watched properly we could end up with another road in the North linking Derry to Belfast, via Ballygawley. There has not been enough focus on the section of road from Ballygawley to Aughnacloy.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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I welcome Deputy Pringle to the joint committee.

Thomas Pringle (Donegal South West, Independent)
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I thank the Chairman, I am not formally a member of the committee for the next hour or so. I am glad to be here to support the delegation from the north west. I congratulate Councillor John Campbell on his recent election to the position of cathaoirleach of Donegal County Council.

From now on I will be a member of this committee. There is no doubt the Chairman and members have supported this project as much as possible and this will continue. The current period of environmental impact assessments will allow for intensive lobbying regarding the new capital programmes here and in the Six Counties. The lobbying can ensure there is firm financial commitment to the project.

The case for the need for this has been well made. It is a stark issue when one looks at the map and the people of Donegal have always been aware of it. The map shows the vital need for connections to the north west. I look forward to working with the committee to lobby for this project and I wish the delegates all the best in their pursuit of this goal.

Seán Crowe (Dublin South West, Sinn Fein)
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I welcome the delegates here today. This project has positive potential written all over it. The presentations outlined clearly the new opportunities, the safety aspect, the employment potential, the tourism benefits, the connectivity and so on associated with this project. It ticks all the boxes. The delegates are not here today to go through the motions, they want this committee and others to be champions for change. The responsibility lies with the members of this committee.

In the past people felt let down regarding this agreement between two Governments that was affected by the financial crisis. What is causing the blockage at the moment? Is the problem financial or political? Is it the case that people may say one thing but the dead hand still applies? Where does the dead hand come from? Is it simply the case that there is insufficient funding at the moment but there will be enough in future so the can is being kicked up the road? When we spoke of this project previously we outlined elements that could proceed north and south of the Border. The delegates referred to elements that have already undergone environmental impact assessments so the next step is to get the two Governments on board. Everyone involved in the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly and other interest groups has committed to this project. The next step is at a different level so the responsibility lies with all of us, as elected representatives, to do as much as we can. We must commit to raising this issue in every forum possible. I hope we can push it forward.

As I said, this project has positive potential written all over it and I appreciate the professionalism of the delegates before us today.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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I congratulate Councillor John Campbell on becoming mayor of the fantastic county of Donegal. I convey my best wishes to Councillor Ian McGarvey who is approaching 85 years of age and was a fine chairman of Donegal County Council. He is an example of how older people can succeed and defy the endemic ageism of political life.

I support totally what Councillor Dan Kelly said. I have raised the issue of the A5 road more often than any other issue before this joint committee because I truly believe we must, as mentioned, champion the Dublin to Derry to Donegal route. The map shows how negligent the Government has been on this. Deputy McHugh is an excellent Chairman of this committee and my comment is not a personal criticism of him but the Government must engage. It is only common sense to say a potential road needs a timeline because the same is true of every capital project. The construction of motorways in the south was subject to timelines that involved planning and so on. I want a timeline for this project because I am sick talking about it.

I am extremely frustrated by what has happened in terms of the route to the north west and the impact all of this has had on economic and social development there. There appears to be something psychologically amiss among the members of both Governments and that is why there has been a lack of progress in respect of this road. I could discuss this matter for a week. I have no doubt there is a major gap in the north west - in the area between Derry and Letterkenny - in the context of economic development. It used to take all day to get to Cork but one can now make the journey in two hours. We are able to zip around the country on all these fabulous roads that have been built but there is a glaring gap in this regard in the north west. That is pathetic.

It is sad that Monaghan has been vainly seeking the princely sum of €1.5 million to narrow the chosen route between Clontibret and Aughnacloy, from 400 m to 100 m, as one of the key preliminary steps in preparing for the upgrade. If the money is eventually provided and if it is necessary to make such a narrowing, it is a bloody farce. I am extremely frustrated. Why the hell is it not possible to provide €1.5 million to define the road clearly in order that no more time will be wasted? Is there a lack of drive among those in the public and political sectors in respect of this matter? What the hell is causing the problems to which I refer. We have discussed this matter on so many occasions but no progress has been made. If the political will is there, major changes can be effected in society. I am of the view that the committee, under the stewardship of the Chairman, should champion some of these causes to the Taoiseach and others in government. The Chairman should be a Minister or a Minister of State and fight for what we are seeking. He should put the screws on the Taoiseach.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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We are digressing slightly from the matter under discussion.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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I do not care, it must be said. Our former esteemed Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine was involved in the Food Harvest 2020 negotiations and obtained a deal for Ireland in respect of fishing. The current Government is copying what went on in that regard every step of the way.

What the hell is holding back progress in respect of the matter to which I refer, particularly in the context of a timeline and the provision of €1.5 million in funding. I spoke to the county engineers in Monaghan a year and a half ago and all they want is funding in respect of the defined route in order that they can get on with the job. What is happening in this regard is very sad and it reflects badly on Ireland Inc. that more progress has not been made. I co-founded a business in Dublin in 1986 and it has become very successful. Being at the centre of the market, having access, etc., proved to be of huge benefit to us. Business people in the north west are cut off. They lack access to broadband services and have no smart phone connectivity. The relevant authorities are being completely negligent when it comes to the Border counties. Who can we get to drive progress in respect of this matter? The committee needs to act as the people's champion. We need to wake up people to what is involved here. It is a national scandal that development of the road to which I refer is not proceeding. That is my honest opinion.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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I will ensure the Taoiseach receives a copy of the Senator's contribution.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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We should bring him in and put the screws on him. The Chairman should use it himself as-----

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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No, that is okay. A number of issues have been raised. Perhaps our guests can decide among themselves how they wish to deal with them.

Brendan Smith (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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I apologise but I must leave to attend another meeting.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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That is not a problem. Perhaps Mr. McSorley or Mr. McLoughlin will comment in the context of the timeline. Much has happened since the end of April and there has been progress. Reading between the lines, there appears to be momentum. Will our guests reassure members that it is moving in the right direction?

Mr. Daniel McSorley:

I will deal with some of the technical questions. There are others in our delegation who are much more qualified to deal with those of a political nature.

I will begin by addressing Deputy Smith's question with regard to money. It is important to reflect quickly on the financial position. Some £400 million was allocated in respect of the two sections of the A5 which were planned and on which work was expected to proceed when we previously discussed this matter with the committee. Of this, £350 million is being supplied by the Northern Executive and two tranches of £25 million will be provided, in 2015 and 2016, by the Government in Dublin. It is clear that none of this money will be able to be used in a practical sense. It is particularly important - this ties in with the question on timing - that we have those moneys reallocated in the next funding round. Indeed, it would be good to have an even greater amount allocated. The £350 million from Northern Ireland was disbursed in respect of other road projects. Theoretically, in the next comprehensive spending round - which begins in 2015 - that money will come back onto the table again. That is the theory in any event. The practical reality is that there will be a debate on the matter. We will discuss this matter with the Northern Ireland Minister for Regional Development, who has responsibility for transport, in the coming month to ensure he bids again for the money in question. It is important to ensure that the £50 million to be provided by the Government on this side of the Border is capable of being spent by the end of 2016. As a result, it needs to be reallocated. In terms of the next funding round, we must also obtain whatever other moneys we can for the budget from the Republic of Ireland. That is critical.

If the various studies and the environmental statement are completed and if the relevant Ministers make decisions, we expect that by the middle of June 2015 decisions will be taken in the context of moving forward with the orders. There is a potential for a public inquiry beyond that and such an inquiry could take place in late 2015. The outcome of the entire process is likely to emerge in 2016. We are not expecting any sod to be turned this side of the 2016-17 financial year. The four-year period commencing in 2016, therefore, will be important. We would advocate that the total allocation for the entire project should cover, if at all possible, those four years. In other words, the project should be phased over that period. The next funding round is, therefore, absolutely critical in terms of timing. We do not have detailed information, the Department has not completed its work and Ministers have not taken decisions. As a result, there are many unknowns. Obviously, there is no certainty and all we can do is provide our best guess with regard to what the timeframe for the project might look like.

Mr. Pat Doherty MP's question relates to the technical issues regarding the Ballygawley-Aughnacloy section of the road. The positive aspect is that the environmental statement will cover the area from Newbuildings to Aughnacloy. This means that the full section has been included. The outcome of the inspector's report on the previous occasion was that some questions arose in the context of the connections around Aughnacloy. There is more work to be done on that. The safe thing to do would be not to be too definitive about how the Aughnacloy aspect will be dealt with and to ensure that it does not block the remainder of the project. Environmentally, the expectation is that it will be dealt with on this occasion. People from Monaghan probably would be more familiar than I with the detail of what is involved but there is an engineering dimension with regard to how the bypass of Aughnacloy will be managed in the context of the new project. That is probably a sensible approach to the design by Roads Service Northern Ireland.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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Deputy Crowe referred to the Monaghan aspect. Would someone like to comment on that?

Mr. Seán Conlon:

I welcome the words of endorsement and indications of support from all of the elected representatives in attendance. The consultation process relating to this matter was exhaustive and extensive.

Three routes emerged and one was chosen. The route goes up towards the Border. However issues arise in the area of the Tully Bog on the Aughnacloy to Ballygawley stretch of road. That means the last part in Monaghan is not yet definitive. The substantive part of the route has been chosen. Up to 99% of the route has been defined and identified. Senator White addressed the issue thoroughly. The problem is that the corridor area is 400 m wide, which is causing distress for land owners, farmers and those whose son or daughter wishes to build on family land. A 400 m corridor of land from Clontibret to the Border has been sterilised and no development of any kind is allowed on it, be it agricultural or residential. We are making an appeal, in addition to what has been previously said on a strategic plan for funding in the coming years, namely, that in Donegal and Monaghan the process in terms of issues that are outside the constraints of the judicial process and the requirements relating to the environment, could be fast-tracked and made more shovel-ready. We have made representations to the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Varadkar, on the Monaghan part of the route, and he is aware of the issue. The matter is on his desk. The provision of €1.5 million could mean the corridor width could be reduced from 400 m to 100 m and the design phase would be completed. The intention is that the project could be shovel-ready. That would alleviate many of the pressures that have arisen due to the intention to have a sterilised corridor of 400 m, which is almost 0.5 km wide.

Mr. John McLaughlin:

I might address the issue raised by Mr. Pat Doherty, MP, on the status of the N14 and the Letterkenny to Strabane route. Four or five years ago the project was split into two portions. The portion closest to Strabane and Lifford became a short section which speeded up matters so that it would not be behind the arrival of the A5. We had to go through all the statutory processes. However, what happened the A5 project since then means we cannot proceed as planned. Those to whom we spoke in the NRA and the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport said the road will be funded when the A5 is delivered. They accept the importance of having a link to Donegal – at least to Lifford – and for it to be set up and done properly. We have worked jointly with Roads Service Northern Ireland to develop that and it is ready to go.

The bigger project is the road to Letterkenny, which we see as vital for the completion of the Dublin to Derry to Donegal route. It is ready to go as well in terms of the routes being selected. What is holding it back is funding. We have not gone through the statutory process yet because that sets in motion the purchase of land and all the associated costs but the project is ready to go. The people in the area and all the land owners are very supportive of it. The project has been ready to go for a number of years and it is simply waiting for budgetary provision.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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Is there a figure envisaged?

Mr. John McLaughlin:

Yes, the cost of the road from Manorcunningham to Lifford and Strabane is estimated at slightly less than €100 million.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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Does the amount include the bridge?

Mr. John McLaughlin:

Yes, that includes the bridge. In addition, there are some added costs but that is the order of magnitude. The construction prices and land cost has reduced in recent years. While the overall expenditure is substantial, it is not that big in the overall context of the capital expenditure programme. We believe the road can and should be provided.

Mr. Eugene Cummins:

Thank you, Chairman, for the opportunity to come before the committee. To return to the questions from Mr. Pat Doherty, MP, and Senator White on the section of the road in Meath, first, the absence of the project is severely restricting the development and potential of County Monaghan. I assure Senator White that there is no lack of public sector drive but what is lacking is-----

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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I did not mean that on a personal basis.

Mr. Eugene Cummins:

I understand that. What is missing is that the project seems to have slipped in importance and significance nationally and between the two Governments. This is a very important project and the future development of the region is being restricted. In Monaghan we must identify funding to progress the design and shadow the work that has been done by the Roads Service Northern Ireland in terms of its advancement of the A5 part of the project. We must follow that and perfect the design in order to address the issue raised by Mr. Pat Doherty, MP, in a timely fashion. I agree with Councillor Conlon that we must be ready when funds become available. The road will have to be built at some stage and not unlike a house or other simple project one must have a design and secure permission before it can go ahead. The early identification of the €1.5 million from Monaghan is badly needed to bring us back up to speed with our colleagues in the Roads Service Northern Ireland. There is an excellent working relationship between our colleagues in the North and ourselves. Both sides are totally at one in wishing to advance the project because it is urgently required.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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There is a good working relationship between the Roads Service Northern Ireland and the NRA as well as the local authorities. Are officials in the Roads Service Northern Ireland sitting around a table deciding on a route? The question is where the A5 links up with the N2 or is it too early to say?

Mr. Eugene Cummins:

That cannot be addressed until the funding is identified and design is perfected. Without perfecting the design the question cannot be fully answered.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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The message is loud and clear.

Mr. Michael Coyle:

Thank you, Chairman. As you know, I chair the North West Region Cross Border Group, which consists of four councils – Donegal, Strabane, Derry and Limavaddy. Currently, we are involved in INTERREG programmes worth up to €30 million and it does restrict what we can do there. I do not know all the technicalities but I agree with Senator White that we need a timeline. Some of my colleagues have indicated the sort of progress we would like to see. Could I request that the committee would become more than just a champion of the project but it would keep the project live? In the past I have seen projects that were proposed, put to one side, brought off the shelf again and discussed again. We need people to feed in constantly to both Governments. The cross-Border areas have particular problems that one would not have between Dublin and Cork or from Derry to Belfast.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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It is a different jurisdiction with two different currencies – sterling and the euro. It is crazy.

Mr. Michael Coyle:

There are relationships between the peoples on both sides of the Border, in particular between Donegal and Derry which are very much linked. I am afraid that if the pressure is not kept on it that the north-west will end up in the dark ages again. We need people to continue to put on pressure.

It only took me three hours to get to Dublin this morning. I can remember 40 years ago when I came to Dublin as a youth that the journey took me at least three and a half hours. There is some improvement but there is much more room for improvement.

The cross-Border group very much supports the work of the A5 group. We see it as part of our business to enhance the lives of those within our region.

Mr. John Campbell:

I will convey Senator White’s good wishes to Councillor McGarvey. It is the first time ever the chain was handed from one Independent councillor to another.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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Hear, hear.

Mr. John Campbell:

There is a sea-change in Donegal County Council.

Ian McGarvey is a man who defies any definition of ageism. If we had a race from the Chamber to Lifford Bridge, I would put my money on him, at 84 years of age, to beat any of us.

Deputy Crowe asked if we believed there are political blocks to the project or just in terms of funding. We have Donegal, Derry, Dungannon, south Tyrone, Monaghan and Omagh and Strabane councils, Irish Central Border Area Network, ICBAN, and the north-west region cross-Border group so there is definitely no political blockage on the ground. We are united on the project. It is a rhetorical question that might be better answered by either the MPs or the TDs and Senators than us. In the meetings we had in recent days I did not see any blockages. There are details to be addressed, as Mr. Cummins, Mr. McSorley and Mr. McLaughlin have outlined. The important one Senator White raised was that of the timeline. Mr. McSorley addressed the indicative timeline, and these other elements have to come into place, and that is why we are here today. It is the next level up. If there is a political, money or any other blockage, it is not at the local level. That is clear from the people around the table today.

Like Deputy Pringle, I am from the south west of the county. Looking at the map one might not see a direct benefit to the Donegal-Killybegs area but I see the potential benefit. The opening up of any area within our county will benefit the entire country, and I am aware there are a number of other projects whether it is the likes of Enniskillen or the port in Killybegs, in which the Irish Government invested significant moneys in the past ten or 15 years and is now showing some benefits. While the benefits may seem far away at times, for our hub of Letterkenny-Derry it is essential for us that this project is progressed. As Mr. McSorley said, we need the issue to be pushed forward by this committee, which we believe is the best committee to do that with both Administrations North and South. I hope we have given the members enough of an outline to help them understand where we see it progressing. There is an indicative timeline and I hope through their own good offices they will ensure that happens.

Mr. Pat Doherty MP:

It is clear, particularly from what Mr. McLaughlin said, that all the councils and agencies in the north west are very much focused on this project and are applying themselves to it. I know from my own dialogue with the Roads Service in the North and the National Roads Authority that they meet regularly on the issue.

That brings us to the question of the finances. Regarding the timescale, as Mr. McSorley outlined, in 2016 we should be starting to make progress. When the Irish Government withdrew its funding as a result of the financial situation, it added a caveat that it was prepared to revisit this project in the capital expenditure programme for 2015. We should focus on that.

In the North, when the moneys were disbursed because they could not be spent there was also a commitment from the Executive, and I stress the Executive, that the money would be ring-fenced when the Southern money came on board again. We need to keep a focus on the North in that regard. Politicians North and South have a job to do to ensure that both the Executive and the Irish Government live up to the commitments they gave publicly. That is our focus, allied with the good work being done by all the agencies on the ground. If we can keep that combination going, we can see this through.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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That contribution is helpful. I thank the members of the delegation for that discussion. This does not end today. The witnesses have highlighted the challenges that lie ahead.

I thank Mr. McSorley for speaking about the review. The capital expenditure review is critical. Coming from Monaghan County Council and Donegal County Council the know what they need, and the important point Mr. Cummins made was that decisions can be made on foot of a level of investment by the Government. We will ensure that the transcripts of the contributions made here will get onto the right desks, be it the Minister, Deputy Varadkar, or whomever, and we can also send it on to the regional Minister in Northern Ireland. We will use the opportunity to raise the issue on 10 July when this committee will go to the North-South Ministerial Council in Armagh and no doubt we will have the agreement of the committee on the priority agendas at that meeting.

We will continue to keep the issue live, which is the message given today. In terms of the perception, people have felt let down in the past in that the project was to go ahead but in the end did not proceed. Financial commitments were given. Without making excuses, issues arose about the state of the economy, the financial crash and so but that is what did happen. We must keep it going, however, and that is the purpose of this meeting. We must be conscious of the timeframe. The Irish Government has committed Stg£25 million in 2015, as Mr. McSorley outlined, and Stg£25 million in 2016. We heard today that if it cannot be spent in 2015, the commitment is Stg£50 million for 2016. We have to ensure that happens and if there are capacity issues, looking at the capital expenditure of Northern Ireland, Greece and so on, we have to keep the pressure on also.

I thank the witnesses. Mr. Doherty will agree it is great to hear Killybegs men advocating road infrastructure up as far as Carrigart and Gortnabrade. I can see where Mr. McLaughlin is coming from in terms of potential. It is not just about the A5 or the M2. It is about Dublin, Derry and Donegal, and linking into the new Wild Atlantic Way. We are seeing an increased number of camper vans heading to Malin Head, across the bridge from Fanad to Carrigart, down to Sliabh League and Killybegs.

Mr. John Campbell:

And Mountcharles too.

Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)
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And Mountcharles. It is not just about a road from points A to B. It is about opening up a region. We all know the historical reasons it has not been opened up but we have so much to offer, and Mr. Kelly outlined the history, scenery and landscape. We thank the witnesses for attending. We will keep the conversation going and do whatever we can at our end.