Mr. Kevin Kinsella:

I will be quick because I am conscious of time. There are no figures setting out precisely how many go up and down. I think Teagasc did some work on this in the past. Of 30,000 sheep farmers in the country, about 10,000 are losing and 20,000 are expected to gain to a greater or lesser extent. In response to Deputy Deering, I cannot say how many would gain under the actual minimum but I think that gives him an idea. I would not necessarily agree with the Deputy's second point that it is a top up. The sheep grassland scheme is in existence at the moment. It was €18 million.

It has been reduced to €14 million. We want it back at €18 million because we consider it sheep money. We want to find the best way to protect it as best we can for sheep farmers. Since it is already in the system, we are not necessarily taking money from anyone else.