Michael McCarthy (Cork South West, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We will discuss the topic London Irish Centre - supporting the Irish community. I welcome from the London Irish Centre Mr. David Barlow, chief executive, and Mr. Gary Dunne, director of arts.
By virtue of section 17(2)(l) of the Defamation Act 2009, witnesses are protected by absolute privilege in respect of their evidence to the joint committee. If they are directed by it to cease giving evidence on a particular matter and continue to so do, they are entitled thereafter only to qualified privilege in respect of their evidence. They are directed that only evidence connected with the subject matter of these proceedings is to be given and asked to respect the parliamentary practice to the effect that, where possible, they should not criticise or make charges against a person or an entity by name or in such a way as to make him, her or it identifiable. The opening statement and any document provided for the committee may be published on its website once the meeting has concluded. Members are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not comment on, criticise or make charges against a person outside the Houses or an official by name or in such a way as to make him or her identifiable.
Last October the clerk to the committee and I visited London. Among other activities, we attended an interesting climate change conference at Westminster and took the opportunity to visit the London Irish Centre. There is not a family in the country that has not been affected by emigration. That is the case with many of my family and social circle. It was an enlightening and insightful experience to witness at first hand the work being done by the centre in Camden. The committee's remit generally covers a great deal of environmental work, given the Departments we mirror. We cover the arts, but we need to maintain our focus on the cultural aspect. We should take advantage of any way we can to support the work of the London Irish Centre. We forget that during the years the centre became the fulcrum of activity for many Irish people who travelled to London not just socially but also in the context of people's identity. The sense of belonging we have as Irish people is well provided for in a variety of ways by the centre and that is important. The reality of the economic downturn is that 20,000 Irish people emigrated to the United Kingdom last year, the majority of whom went to London. The support the centre gives is as relevant today as it was when it was set up almost 60 years ago. I hope the committee will become more aware of that work during our deliberations. Most of our visitors come here by train or car, but the delegates had to fly from Heathrow Airport. I acknowledge their effort and the extra mile they had to go to attend. I ask Mr. Barlow to address the committee.

Mr. David Barlow:

I thank the Chairman and committee members for inviting us. It was a pleasure to go the extra mile to be with them. I will run through a brief history of the organisation and then concentrate on outlining the services we offer, both welfare and cultural services, how we link with people today, how this is relevant to their needs and what we are doing to promote Ireland in London.

The London Irish Centre is the oldest and largest Irish charity in Britain. It was founded by the church in 1954 and we are currently celebrating our 60th anniversary. It was founded primarily to provide accommodation, social care, employment and, importantly, ensure Irish emigrants arriving in Britain maintained their faith. That was important to the Catholic Church which had founded the centre. My mother at the tender age of 16 years left what was a poor County Clare in 1951 and arrived in Euston Station on her own three years before the centre was established. It means a lot to me as the chief executive to support the people with whom she travelled and in the years that followed. We still ensure we provide a safe place and a safe start for those making what is probably a much easier journey now.

Since the early days, we have been at the heart of the Irish community in the heart of London. Only yesterday, I looked at an RTE archives film from 1968. RTE came and filmed during the mid-years of the centre and showed people celebrating a céilí and attending mass there. It hammers home the importance of the work we currently do with the older generation who were in that archive film. That is important to us today. The centre has been in place for the past 60 years through the good times for the Irish community but also through some bad times. Originally people came over in a recession; another cohort came in the 1980s and, more recently, many younger people have come to London looking for work. They do not necessarily want to travel to London or leave their homeland. We were also there for people through the Troubles. There was a time - it is documented in all of our records - when the centre was raided almost on a nightly basis by the police service in England to check that everything was above board.

Nowadays we are no longer a ghetto of Irishness. The last thing we want to be is such a ghetto in one of the most diverse cities in the world; therefore, we are outward looking and have integrated. Only 24 hours ago, Mr. Dunne and I attended an event in the parliament at Westminster with the Taoiseach, the UK Leader of the Opposition, Mr. Ed Miliband, and a range of political representatives from the North and across the United Kingdom hosted by a charity founded to look at positive relations between the two states and cross-Border co-operation. Our work no longer necessarily is done in a ghetto. We are now in a different environment. We proudly wave the tricolour from our building and are very much part of the scene in London. Ours remains one of the largest independent welfare organisations in the city. Last year we supported 14,000 people, more than 78% of whom were Irish, most of whom were first generation. We provided varying degrees of support and classed more than 5,000 of them as vulnerable. They are homeless or have severe addictions and mental health problems. We work with families in poverty and those who perhaps are about to lose their homes because of changes to the UK welfare benefit system. Our work is increasing. We have seen more people come in in the past two or three years.

We are doing this alongside having tighter and tighter financial funding restraints.

We value and celebrate our history, but we are certainly not complacent about our services. In 2012 we launched the biggest piece of research ever carried out of the Irish community in London. A total of 855 people - first and second generation - were interviewed about their needs as Irish people and their expectations of Irish services in London. That publication was launched at the UK Parliament's buildings at Westminster and has been referenced in the Dáil and the Westminster Parliament. The reason we produced it was to make sure our services were meeting the needs of people today, not just perceived needs. There are over 130 Irish organisations in Britain, many of which have been using it also to make sure they are tailoring their services to meet the needs of the Irish population in Britain.

There are many perceptions about whom Irish charitable organisations are helping in Britain and much of our innovation is about making sure our services are meeting needs. Only 32% of our clients are over 50 years of age and it is very important to provide services for them. They are the very people I mentioned who came over in the 1950s and 1960s, many of whom are now becoming frail and elderly. We provide befriending and support services for them, including luncheon clubs, bingo clubs, line dancing and so on. However, the biggest group we work with are aged between 26 and 49 years and represent 63% of our clients. There is a growing number of people in their twenties and early thirties coming to London in the past few years.

The other perception which is false is that all younger Irish people coming to Britain are prepared, have decent jobs, are well educated and can settle in easily. That may be the case for many of them, but we are finding that many younger people are coming over without planning their journey and that they are running into difficulties. Jobs or housing that might have been promised to them do not materialise and they quickly find themselves unemployed, homeless and in poverty. We are there to support them also.

I am second generation Irish, as I was born and brought up in the south east of England, and when I moved to live in south-east London as a young person in my early 20s, I had a very large Irish family connection in west London, but I might as well as have been living in Sydney because the enormity of London and the distances involved made it a very lonely place until I could get to see people at weekends. One of the things we are now doing is making sure we are providing services for the many younger people who are coming over who want to celebrate their Irishness, be involved in the organisation and do something with which they can identify as being part of their roots back in Ireland.

I would like to provide one example of a client who I personally helped recently. When we were short of staff a couple of months ago - the staff were very stretched at the time - a young guy came to us. We offer shower facilities and clothing for people who are homeless. The young guy was in his mid-20s and had been in London for just over six months, having left the west of Ireland owing to family issues and relationship problems. He had a job and planned his journey to London, but one evening a couple of weeks after he had arrived he was mugged and it caused him to lose his job, as he was no longer able to work in labouring. He had nasty injuries and was hospitalised for a time. As a result, he could not pay his rent and within a few months was knocking on our door to get clothes from our clothing store and food vouchers. He was sleeping rough down the road in north London. After he had had a shower, I discovered that what he really wanted to do was talk about his situation. We chatted for about half an hour and he was desperate to go home, but he felt he could not return to his previous environment owing to relationship problems. He had one distant relative, but he did not have the means to travel back to Ireland because he was that poor and destitute. We were able to contact his relative and make sure she was happy to put him up and we repatriated him the next morning. We checked it out in order that we knew he was safe, secure, warm and had a roof over his head. This is one of many examples of the work we do on our welfare side.

Obviously, we do not just provide welfare services. Our cultural programme is integrated with our welfare programme and is headed up by Mr. Gary Dunne who will answer questions about it. It is the largest such programme in Britain. In 2013 over 23,000 individuals took part in our arts and cultural events. Our events are extremely diverse, ranging from large-scale festivals such as the Return to Camden Town Festival, the biggest traditional Irish music festival in Britain, to the more contemporary comedy festival which showcases top Irish comedians from Britain and the island of Ireland. It is now in its second year. We have more niche events such as the London Irish Book Club which consists of a small group who meet to look at books. This is very relevant to our trip as later today we will be talking about our library. We are absolutely delighted and very thankful for the support of the committee in helping us to boost it and I am even more delighted to see the books in the flesh, so to speak.

To mark our 60th anniversary, we have a major concert series which is being part-funded by Culture Ireland. We have nine top-of-the-range acts, alongside our normal culture programme, and are very grateful to Culture Ireland for supporting it. In addition to our mainstream cultural programme, we do an awful lot of partnership work which is very much about bringing Irish art to Britain. I have spoken a lot about welfare issues and what we do in-house, but we are not a ghetto; we are very much about showcasing Irish art in Britain. Mr. Dunne and others in the London Irish Centre have been instrumental in working with the British Museum, the South Bank Arts Centre and the University of London, Goldsmith's College. We were commissioned last year and again this year by the Irish Embassy to deliver the Irish Showcase, the leading Irish art showcase in Britain. One of the biggest things in which we are involved is working with the programmers for the concert at the Royal Albert Hall for the President next month. We are very honoured that the London Irish Centre is working on it also.

We want to be a voice for Ireland and the Irish in London. If one types the words "London Irish" on Google, ours is the first organisation one will probably find.

We want to continue doing this for the next 60 years. We could not do the work we do without the support we get from the Irish Government, particularly the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade through the immigrant support programme. We value that support. In the current financial year which ends this month 48% of our £1.2 million operating costs comes from the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade. The remaining 52% is made up through general fund-raising, property rental and other endeavours. The funding provided by the Irish Government is crucial to the work to which I referred in the area of the arts and welfare. We thank the Irish people, through the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade and the Government, for this support. We assure the Irish people that we will endeavour to continue to provide services to meet the needs of their elderly relatives in London for the next 60 years. I also assure them that we are also looking after their sons, daughters and siblings who find themselves in London, be it by way of assisting them in finding somewhere they can celebrate being Irish or, if they need it, giving them a helping hand along the way.

I thank the committee for inviting us. It is a great privilege to be here.

Michael McCarthy (Cork South West, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I thank Mr. Barlow for his insightful comments.

Catherine Murphy (Kildare North, Independent)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I thank Mr. Barlow for his interesting presentation. Like others, I have family members scattered all over the world, including in London. Mr. Barlow has mentioned that the centre works with people in London who present as homeless in securing housing. I presume it does not work directly with them in that regard but does so through the authorities in London or other parts of the United Kingdom. I am interested in hearing how this manifests in the context of the changes in UK welfare policy referred to by Mr. Barlow.

Mr. Barlow also referred to the false perception that young Irish people going abroad were prepared, well educated and so on. Perhaps he might elaborate further on that issue in terms of the extent of the problem relative to the number of people who emigrate. For example, is the percentage very high or is this something of which the centre would be aware? Mr. Barlow might also outline what he believes could be done here in preparing people for emigration.

Mr. David Barlow:

In terms of housing, we ceased providing accommodation directly many years ago. As I said, the centre started out as a hostel. We do, however, signpost people to emergency accommodation. We have links with emergency hostels supported, for example, by the Shelter organisation. We also work with local authorities to get people into emergency accommodation. That task is getting harder because, as I am sure members of the committee are aware through the media, the accommodation problem in London is worsening because rents are escalating enormously. The majority of people, including those in well paid jobs, who are trying to get a foot on the ladder and provide their own accommodation are finding it very difficult to do so. This links in with the false hopes people have in coming to the United Kingdom which, in turn, links in with what we are trying to do. The committee might be able to help by ensuring people who are thinking of moving to London or other cities in Britain are educated about the realities of doing so.
In 2011 we launched an information booklet, which is also available online. I understand it is also available online in most Irish libraries and other places where people might go to research coming to Britain. The booklet is entitled Moving to London,and provides people with realistic information on what they can expect in terms of the geography of London and how vast it is compared to most cities on the island of Ireland and the position on rents. Given the many changes that have occurred in the past three years, the booklet could probably do with being updated. A number of people coming to London expect to be able to rent a two bedroom house in north London. The London Irish Centre owns three garages which it is proposed to demolish and replace with a two bedroom house which we can rent to boost our income. Its rentable value will be £3,500 per month. That is the cost of renting a house in the area, which, while a good one, is not one of the wealthiest. These are the types of issue about which people need to be made aware. They need to know that if they do secure accommodation, it is likely to be a flat-share in a not so nice area. Anything the Irish Government or organisations and agencies could do to support our work in educating people on the realities of moving to London would be welcome.

Mr. Gary Dunne:

On the second question, we do not have detailed information on the percentage split between young Irish graduate emigrants who are well set up and in secure jobs in professional industries and those for whom the move is more difficult. We know from our research that the perception is that every young emigrant is a graduate, but that is not the case. We deal with people for whom the move is much more difficult and who find themselves in crisis. We are investing heavily in providing resources in order that people can prepare before they make the move. In the social media area we have 20,000 people. Our website is visited by approximately 500 people per day, many of whom download the booklet mentioned by Mr. Barlow in preparation for their move.

Caít Keane (Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I welcome the delegates. We have all heard of the London Irish Centre and the good work it is doing. While I have often visited London, I have never been in the centre. My daughter moved to London two years ago where she set up her own business. I must tell her to ensure she calls in to the centre. Perhaps on the next occasion I visit London I might visit it with her.

Mr. Barlow has mentioned that there are 130 Irish organisations in London, including a branch of the GAA and so on. I have not checked, but I am sure they are all listed on the centre's website. Deputy Catherine Murphy discussed the issue of housing with the delegates. I am interested in discussing the issue of enterprise with them. Mr. Barlow has said the centre hosts cultural evenings and so on. Does it ever host enterprise evenings, through which it could network with agencies such as Enterprise Ireland?

The comedy festival was mentioned. Irish people are noted for their comedy. Irish comedians who have gone to London have done very well; some of them have taken over the BBC, but I will not mention any names. During one of my visits to London I attended a comedy festival. It was probably hosted by the London Irish Centre, but I did not realise it at the time.

I congratulate the centre on its work. In working together we can be stronger. This is Seachtain na Gaeilge in Ireland. In working together to preserve our culture we are stronger. Perhaps the delegates might respond to my comments on the 130 Irish organisations in London and the enterprise issue.

Mr. David Barlow:

I will try to respond to the Senator's question about the 130 Irish organisations in London, following which Mr. Dunne will respond to her question on enterprise and the work we are doing in that regard.

I believe the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade funds or part funds 130 organisations across Britain, not just in London. They could be extremely small and provide a specific service for a few Irish people in small towns and cities. They are not on our scale. We do not have a list of them, but the Department would. It is a diverse range of organisations, some of which would not provide the direct welfare services about which we spoke or an arts programme. They may be social clubs.

Mr. Gary Dunne:

I will pick up where Mr. Barlow left off. It all depends on how one defines an Irish organisation. The statistic Mr. Barlow cited is for Irish community organisations, of which ours is the biggest.

The London Irish Centre’s mission statement is to support the Irish community and promote Irish culture. As an entity or a charity, there are two ways by which we can support Irish business, one of which is by providing space. We have invested a great deal to make our big old centre in Camden Town suitable for hosting quality events. The second way is marketing. We work closely with groups such as the London Irish Business Society, LIBS; the London Irish Graduate Network, LIGN; and the Irish International Business Network, IIBN. We have good working relationships with these groups and do not have the staff or capacity to be particularly proactive in supporting business. Where we can, we do by offering space and marketing support.

Labhrás Ó Murchú (Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Tá céad míle fáilte romhaibh. The delegates are very welcome. Their presentation was very helpful and inspiring. I acknowledge the work of the Chairman and the clerk in making this visit possible. They have shown prowess in collecting, if my figures are right, over 6,000 books and 1,000 CDs and DVDs. This says something about the work they have done, but it also says a lot about the Irish in Britain and the affection for, and strong links with, them.

I had the privilege and pleasure last year of hosting two groups of Irish senior citizens from Britain. The event was organised by Sally Mulready, a remarkable lady who is a Labour Party councillor in Britain but also sits on the Council of State with the President. Over the course of several hours with the people concerned I saw their great emotion when thinking about the homeland and their great pride. I did not hear one negative word from them.

The work of the London Irish Centre in Camden Town is unique and historic. It was the first port of call for many Irish people who found themselves in difficulties for different reasons. I saw how they were received with respect and given help exactly when it was required. The new wave of emigration and the thousands of people going to the United Kingdom again must cast the London Irish Centre back into a role which, to some extent, had been changing.

I presume the London Irish Centre receives funding from the Irish abroad or the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade or some source in Ireland. How successful has it been in accessing funding from British sources such as the welfare system and so on? I recall Fr. Sheridan years ago banging down many doors until he ensured what was available to UK citizens and other ethnic groups was made available to the Irish. What is that relationship like now?

Other ethnic groups have the same issues as the Irish. Does the London Irish Centre interact with them? Do they come along and display their wares and so on? There is a seanfhocal, ní neart go cur le chéile - there is strength in unity. Are there opportunities to work with the other groups? It is more difficult for Irish people leaving now because there are no jobs. What is the position when they arrive in Britain? The delegates mentioned insufficient planning. I can understand this because many young people never saw themselves having to leave Ireland. The recession has happened quickly. Do they have great difficulty in accessing work when they arrive? What type of work is available? The construction industry absorbed many members of the Irish community in the past.

The question of votes for Irish emigrants may be outside the delegates’ remit. Are they as exercised about it abroad as we are here? It is often discussed at the Convention on the Constitution and debated in both Houses of the Oireachtas. I am sure it is a discussion point. The delegates might have a more focused idea because they are at the coalface. The Convention on the Constitution suggested that where there would be votes, perhaps for the President, they be confined to those who had emigrated in recent years. I have received a lot of correspondence from people abroad in a different age group who would feel left out if that were to be the case. I am not ignoring the logistical problems but focusing on the emotion. What is the thinking on the voting issue? How important is it and for what should they vote?

I compliment the London Irish Centre on its outstanding work. It played a very important role during the Troubles in Northern Ireland. They also visited Britain when the Irish community came under terrible pressure. Places such as the London Irish Centre became a focal point where people went to have a sense of security or support. I presume this has changed, particularly since the Queen’s visit here and given the President’s forthcoming official visit to Britain. I presume, too, that the Irish community in Britain looks forward to a new future now that our relationship with its adoptive country has changed.

Mr. David Barlow:

I thank the Senator for his kind words about our work. I touched on his final point in my few words at the beginning of the meeting. Our place in London has changed. From talking to people who have been involved in the organisation throughout the decades and reading our archives, I get a real sense of how people on both sides of the divide found refuge in the London Irish Centre, particularly in the 1970s. We now proudly fly the tricolour outside our building. It was not until President Robinson visited in the mid-1990s that there was a tricolour near the building because it was not the thing to do in those challenging times. I read that one was hastily stuck to the wall minutes before her car arrived.

We have moved on a long way. There were people from all the United Kingdom and Northern Ireland parties in particular with the Taoiseach and leading politicians in Westminster yesterday with a bright green London Eye opposite on the banks of the Thames. That proves how our work has moved from being a place of refuge and ghetto to a place that is far more dynamic and active as part of the wider community. That links to the work as a black, minority, ethnic - BME - organisation. We work locally and across London with other ethnic minority organisations and we have shared work regarding the storing of information on ethnicity with other ethnic organisations. We host the main group of London Somalis at the London Irish Centre, and they have conferences and regular meetings there. We are diverse, although we are very proudly first and foremost Irish. Our doors are open as part of the community sharing everything that is good about being Irish with the rest of the London community. We also welcome the rest of the community interested in us. It is a different place which is very dynamic, innovative and refreshing in which to work. Much of that is thanks to the cross-Border co-operation and developing issues over the past decade and a half.

Some 48% of our income is from an emigrant support programme and that is very valuable to us. The Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade has told us it must be spread further as more Irish organisations set up to support waves of emigration to places like Australia, Canada and New Zealand. The vast majority of the money comes to organisations in Britain, and although the pot is not diminishing, it must do more work for more people across more parts of the world. Much of our income used to emanate from UK local authorities, particularly around north London, where we are based. As a result of very tough funding cuts in the past three or four years in the UK, much of that money has dried up and it is much harder to get funding for services.

As an example, we used to get a grant from our local authority, the London borough of Camden, to provide a day service for vulnerable and elderly Irish people, but that no longer comes to us for two reasons. The funding system has changed, so people who need support from the local authority must have personal payments. Individuals, through their social workers, must buy services, so we no longer get a grant to provide a service, as individuals must buy the service at a rate per day. That makes it very difficult to plan services. As a result of the manner in which funding is legislated for in the UK, asking for specific funding for the Irish community is impossible when dealing with local authorities. Bodies must provide services to the entire community, which makes the provision of culturally specific services much more difficult. That is where our co-operation with other ethnic minorities in London works, and we can put in joint bids for issues affecting the community.

The funding issue is difficult. Like most charitable organisations in Britain, we must consider every penny or cent we are spending, and we have cut costs by approximately 12% in the current financial year. It is very tough to keep up with reductions in income generation none the less. For our 60th anniversary this year we are trying to pull out all the stops to promote what we are doing across London and in Ireland to let people know the importance of the services we are trying to offer. We want to let people know the reality of the work we are doing. Although certain people know what we are doing, there is a majority with the wrong perception of what we do. They may think we are a big social club or stuck in decades gone by in providing a specific type of service that does not appeal to people coming to London now. We cannot be complacent and much of our work must be innovative. We need to show people what we are doing and how efficient and effective are our services, as well as the value for the people using them.

Mr. Gary Dunne:

The only point I wanted to address was the question of how young emigrants find it to arrive in London. As Mr. Barlow mentioned, we carried out the largest research process ever carried out on the Irish in London two years ago, entitled Fresh Perspectives, which was a community needs analysis. From that, we can see that 60% of the recent migrant cohort aged between 18 to 35 were going to managerial and professional industries, only 10% were going to manual and traditional roles and the rest were students. Another interesting point from the needs analysis was how difficult young migrants found the transition to the London workplace. It is a very competitive work market and work plays a central role in the lives of Londoners. I am sure it does here as well. It was a significant finding that people found the adjustment quite difficult.

Labhrás Ó Murchú (Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Did the issue of votes for Irish emigrants arise or is it a big issue?

Mr. Gary Dunne:

I do not feel qualified to comment much on that. It is a shame our trustee, Professor Mary Hickman, is not here today. She leads on the issue of votes for Irish citizens abroad. We have hosted a number of debates around the issue and we are very keen to have more of that conversation around Ireland, Irishness and the diaspora. I do not have a personal opinion on it today but there is an engaged conversation ongoing.

Marcella Corcoran Kennedy (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I welcome the witnesses. It has been a fascinating and mind-expanding afternoon. We are aware of the centre in London but I had no idea about the level of service or how long it has been there. We appreciate the witnesses coming here to give us some more information. I am interested in the number of volunteers as well as expert staff. How many are there and how many are required? Is the centre able to maintain the numbers of volunteers? No matter what the type, when an organisation is trying to reach out into communities, it will always require volunteers. They play a vital role and there is more to it than just volunteerism. How is the issue managed?

The Government is having research done by UCD on the diaspora but has the centre played any role in it or does it see a role in that respect? I know the centre has extensive programmes promoting Irish arts and culture, providing many Irish music and language classes. Is it mostly Irish people participating in that or are people from other cultures interested? Is that encouraged? Will the witnesses expand on the missing persons service, which is an interesting initiative? I have not heard of any other group doing something like that.

Mr. Gary Dunne:

I am happy to speak about the volunteering aspect. We have two volunteering staff and more than 150 volunteers. I was reading again the history of the centre on the way over in preparation for today, and we published The Scatteringin 2004, which was our 50th anniversary. It reminded me that we have this beautiful premises because of the voluntary work of Irish predecessors and ancestors in London.

The centre was set up by the church and volunteers. They bought one little bit first and voluntary Irish labour built the place. Volunteering has always been a key part of the centre. We have 150 volunteers today. I started in the centre as a volunteer six years ago. Our volunteers do everything from befriending, which as the name suggests includes going out to visit older Irish people in London, to running Facebook pages to pouring tea at tea dances, to doing box office at the London Irish comedy festival. There has always been, and it is very much the case these days, a strong culture of the community supporting the community.

Only last week I inducted seven new young Irish arts volunteers. They are young Irish people in their mid to late 20s who have signed up specifically to be arts volunteers. There is an interesting motivation there when one asks people why they are volunteering. Interestingly, for them it is about belonging. They are in London and they are fully integrated into London life but they get a sense of belonging, connection and groundedness from having an organic link with their roots.

We have done quite well in retaining volunteers. Our two volunteer staff seem to manage them really well. We have a big summer event and a big winter event and there is a lovely energy around the whole project. That is what I have to say about volunteering.

Mr. David Barlow:

I thought Mr. Dunne would have taken all of the questions. Could the Deputy remind me about the other elements?

Marcella Corcoran Kennedy (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I inquired about the arts and cultural events and the fact that there are Irish language classes and music classes. Is it mostly Irish people who participate or are other nationalities becoming involved? Are the classes open to other nationalities?

Mr. Gary Dunne:

It is an interesting question and one I could talk about for hours. It depends on the event. For example, we had the Cork songwriter, Mick Flannery, playing in the centre two weeks ago. The event was sold out. Four hundred people attended as part of the Culture Ireland 60th anniversary concert series which David mentioned. One of our new volunteers carried out a survey at the desk. He asked where people had heard about the gig and whether they were Irish or non-Irish for market research purposes. Up to 40% of the crowd for that gig were non-Irish.
We had the famous Bothy Band piper, Paddy Keenan, in the week after and 77% of the audience were Irish. That is a mix of Irish-born people and people who identify as Irish. Even within the Irish language it depends on the level. In the beginners class 70% of those who attend are Irish. It is a different split at intermediate level and nearly 100% of those in the advanced class are Irish.
In terms of the people who come to our events, it depends on the events. I could talk about them all day. In terms of our motivation, we are trying to do at least two things at the same time. First, we offer a taste of home and an opportunity to celebrate their roots and identity to Irish people in London. Second, we are funded by bodies such as Culture Ireland, whose primary aim is to promote Irish arts on the international market and we are building relationships with TimeOut, The Guardianand the Evening Standardto bring the very best of Irish programming to London audiences. That echoes David’s reference to partnership events with the South Bank and Goldsmiths where we are in place almost as consultants and bring the best of Irish to their markets.

Marcella Corcoran Kennedy (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The other question related to the Irish diaspora research UCD is doing at the moment to try to find out about the number of young people who have gone to London in the past five years and the role of the witnesses in that research, if any.

Mr. Gary Dunne:

Our role has been central. Professor Liam Kennedy from the Michael Smurfit Graduate Business School came to visit our senior management team and I met him with David and Jenny, our director of welfare. Our initial meeting related more to older emigrants from the 1950s and 1960s wave. I presume most members know that related to the ten-year review of the emigrant support programme and looking to future needs.

This week we gathered a group of young migrants as a focus group for Professor Kennedy to meet. The meeting has not happened yet but there is a huge interest from people wishing to take part. The meeting should happen in the coming weeks. He was very pleased that we had access to that demographic.

Marcella Corcoran Kennedy (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The other question then was about the missing persons service.

Mr. Gary Dunne:

Historically, that has been run by volunteers. The last statistic I got is that we get about 30 inquiries a year. In number terms it is not a very busy service but it is significant in terms of impact and outcomes. It is deep, heavy work that people are doing in that regard. Our volunteer manager, Sarah, is in the process of building a new model for managing volunteers, and training and inducting new volunteers to manage the service. The service is getting a bit of a refresh but there is significant demand on it.

Marcella Corcoran Kennedy (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

In relation to arts and culture, has the centre made any links with Irish film makers? We have quite a lot of young Irish film makers who are doing tremendous work and getting international recognition and I would be interested to hear if there are any links because the centre’s story is such an amazing one and there are fantastic outcomes for people who connect with it on so many different levels. I would be interested in hearing if anyone has reached out to the centre in terms of putting something on film about it.

Mr. Gary Dunne:

Does Deputy Corcoran Kennedy mean in terms of telling the story?

Marcella Corcoran Kennedy (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Yes.

Mr. Gary Dunne:

As part of our 60th anniversary year we have a film maker called Jenny Kehoe who is coming over in September to do a short film on stories of the London Irish Centre. That is more specifically a reflection within the context of our 60th anniversary. We have not done anything about the story of the Irish centre. I agree that it should be done.

Marcella Corcoran Kennedy (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It would be interesting to explore it with the Irish Film Board or other such body.

Mr. Gary Dunne:

We work very closely with the Irish Film Institute, IFI. This weekend we have an Irish film festival in the Prince Charles cinema in Leicester Square as part of the London St. Patrick’s festival. We are also a partner organisation of the Irish film festival in London with our friends in the Irish Cultural Centre in Hammersmith.

Brian Stanley (Laois-Offaly, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I thank Gary and David for coming along. Is Gary “Woodlawn Gary”?

Mr. Gary Dunne:

Yes.

Brian Stanley (Laois-Offaly, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I was looking at him for the past half hour and I thought that was definitely the case. That is okay. There is also a Coote Street connection.

Mr. Gary Dunne:

Bhíomar i rang Gaeilge le chéile.

Brian Stanley (Laois-Offaly, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Yes. We were in Coote Street and Woodlawn. I was in Britain in the early 1980s. I was involved in a number of Irish organisations in the north of England that focused on some of the issues we are talking about. The witnesses will be pleased to hear that Laois library sent books to the book project. I hope they will be of some benefit.

I wish to refer to the status and welfare of the Irish community. I did not live in London but I was there on a number of occasions. In the north of England and in cities such as Coventry and Leeds – Manchester is not too bad because there is critical mass, as is the case in London – I found that it was very difficult for Irish emigrants. In some places there was not even an Irish centre. The Federation of Irish Societies, as it was, tried to reach out to as many people as possible. How intact is the network now?

I was part of a group at the time that focused on trying to get ethnic minority status on the agenda because we felt very strongly that, to put it crudely, the Irish community was not getting a slice of the action compared to other ethnic minorities. We felt that we did not have the lobbying power, coherence or status of other ethnic minorities. From what was said it seems the witnesses believe that minority status has been achieved.

The other issue I wish to ask about is voting rights. Sinn Féin introduced a Bill in the House yesterday to extend voting rights in presidential elections to Irish people living abroad. We know there are logistical challenges in that but we feel they should be overcome in the interests of the diaspora. I agree with what Mr. Barlow said about Mary Robinson earlier. To her credit, she went to a lot of places that no President ever went before, including in this country. She was the first President to push the boundaries in that regard and President Higgins is continuing in her footsteps, thankfully. Indeed, Mary McAleese played her part too. Apart from being symbolic, the role of President has a global reach and status and we feel that extending voting rights for presidential elections would be a very positive step in terms of embracing and reaching out to the Irish community abroad, particularly in England, Scotland and Wales.

There has been a lot of talk recently about reform of the Seanad, following the turbulent referendum campaign. Do the witnesses feel that extending voting rights for the Seanad would be of benefit to the Irish community in Britain?

Mr. David Barlow:

On Deputy Stanley's first point about the linking up of various organisations, the Federation of Irish Societies, which celebrated its 40th anniversary last year, was renamed and is now known as Irish in Britain. It is very much a leading force in terms of bringing all of the Irish organisations together. It has a challenging job because it represents welfare and arts organisations like the London Irish Centre as well as various Irish social clubs. It represents a very wide range of Irish organisations and is still very much to the fore in providing support across Britain.

In terms of the black and ethnic minority, BME, community, my personal opinion is that the Irish community is still not as recognised as other ethnic minority communities in London. While it is not one of our charitable objectives to be a campaigning organisation, we certainly need to get the message across to our funders about the importance of culturally-specific services, both in terms of welfare and well-being. When I refer to well-being services I mean things like ceilís, meet-up groups and so forth that improve peoples' social inclusion and general well being.

On the question of voting rights in the Irish presidential elections, as an organisation we do not have a view on that one way or the other but we have supported a number of organisations and groups by offering our premises for meetings, seminars and discussions on such topics. There are organisations which were specifically set up to address issues relating to votes but that would not be part of the remit of the London Irish Centre.

Brian Stanley (Laois-Offaly, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Just a final word on books - I note that both Mr. Dunne's mother and grandmother did a lot of writing.

Michael McCarthy (Cork South West, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Perhaps they will embark on a tour of Portlaoise.
I thank all members and guests for participating in this very interesting exchange. Our guests have helped greatly in giving us a better understanding of the work that is being done in Britain and highlighting areas in which there have been huge improvements in terms of the services provided to Irish emigrants to Britain. Those services are every bit as important in 2014 as they were in times past. I thank SenatorÓ Murchú for the very generous donation to the library scheme by Comhaltas Ceoltoirí Éireann. That organisation has provided a very fine selection of music DVDs and CDs which will give many hours of pleasure to people in the London Irish Centre for years to come.
I remind everyone that the launch is happening in the coffee dock in Leinster House at 6 p.m. and everyone is welcome. We have two very distinguished visitors in the Public Gallery who will be joining us for our celebration and launch this evening. I welcome Martina Devlin and Ré Ó Laighéis and look forward to hearing them in full flight at the launch later.