Pat Breen (Clare, Fine Gael)
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I apologise to our guests for not greeting them before the meeting. The foyer was very busy. I ask members, delegates and those in the Visitors Gallery to ensure their mobile phones are switched off completely for the duration of the meeting as they cause interference with the recording equipment, even when switched to silent mode.

On behalf of the joint committee, I extend a warm welcome to representatives of Habitat for Humanity. We are all aware of the rapid urbanisation of developing countries and the consequential pressure this places on the need for housing. This discussion of the issue of housing in developing countries is, therefore, timely as we have not discussed the theme for some time. I look forward to the contributions of our guests on the issue. As they will be aware, delegations from the committee travel to the developing world from time to time to observe people in their local environments and learn about how they live. It is important for us to learn about the role of Habitat for Humanity and I am very pleased to have representatives of the organisation before us. The principal speakers are Mr. Vincent Cunningham, executive director, Habitat for Humanity Ireland, and Mr. Kebede Abebe, national director, Habitat for Humanity Ethiopia. Mr. Cunningham and Mr. Abebe are accompanied by Ms Jeannie McCann, communications manager. Without further ado, I invite our guests to make a presentation, after which we will have a question and answer session.

Mr. Vincent Cunningham:

It is a great honour to come before the joint committee and have an opportunity to speak to its members. Habitat for Humanity's vision is of a world in which everyone has a decent place to live. Our work is anchored in the conviction that access to simple, decent housing provides a solid foundation to break the cycle of poverty and create a brighter future for all children. Many members will be familiar with Habitat for Humanity's work in Dublin, including our renovation projects with Dublin City Council. Deputy Eric Byrne attended the dedication ceremony for our houses in Inchicore at which our patron, President Michael D. Higgins, handed over the keys. Constituents of members may also have travelled to our partner countries as part of our international volunteering programme. Members may also be familiar with Irish Aid's support for our orphaned and vulnerable children programme in Zambia. Habitat for Humanity greatly appreciates all the support it receives for these programmes.

The purpose of our presentation is to discuss the reasons it is critical to prioritise housing in an urbanising world. The pace of change in our world is dramatic. Rapid urbanisation is challenging our understanding of poverty and how we work to eliminate it. For the first time in history, more than half of the world's population are living in cities. In the next two decades 95% of urban growth will be in developing countries. It is projected that by 2050, 70% of the world's population will live in urban areas, with the total slum population set to double to 2 billion.

Cities are unprepared to accommodate this growth, resulting in the rapid expansion of slums, forcing families to live in inhumane conditions when their only goal is to earn enough income to build better lives for themselves and their children. Urgent action is needed to reduce the negative effects of urbanisation and ensure cities an become engines of growth and sustainability for all.

Housing is an urgent growing global issue. Housing is more than four walls and a roof. Adequate housing includes sufficient space, security of tenure and access to basic services such as water and sanitation. A safe and secure home provides more than protection from the elements. Studies have shown the positive impact adequate housing has on individuals, on their health, on their education and on their livelihood. Overcrowded rooms, dirt floors, poor ventilation, unhealthy living conditions and doors that do not lock, all take their toll on a family's health. Investment in adequate housing is, therefore, critical to the reduction of poverty in the future.

Despite our changing world, poor housing and slum conditions are not new. Since the industrial revolution, slum conditions have emerged in cities as poor migrants arrived to work in factories. During times of emigration in Irish history, many of our ancestors left Ireland and arrived in the slums of London and New York in search of work and a better life. At the turn of the last century overcrowded and dilapidated housing was rampant in Dublin and other parts of the country. In today's economic climate many cannot access mortgage finance. There is a growing social housing waiting list and there are also too many empty homes. This requires urgent action and we in Habitat are ready to be part of the solution.

Every day in 70 countries around the world local Habitat organisations are working alongside local families and communities to improve their living conditions - building, renovating and repairing their homes. Last year Habitat for Humanity served 124,946 families globally which is equal to helping one family every four minutes. Our habitat colleagues such as Mr. Kebede Abede are shelter experts in their own countries. They understand the challenges and develop innovative sustainable solutions to address their urgent growing need. This includes building and renovating homes but it also includes incremental solutions, microfinance, water and sanitation upgrades.

I wish to introduce the committee to Mr. Kebede Abede, national director of Habitat for Humanity Ethiopia to explain its work there.

Mr. Kebede Abebe:

Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen. I am the national director of Habitat for Humanity Ethiopia. I thank the Chairman for the opportunity to appear before the committee. I feel honoured and privileged to be here today to speak about what we do in Habitat for Humanity Ethiopia.
I have served for 12 and a half years as a national director of Habitat for Humanity. By profession I am a civil engineer. When I graduated I had intended to do some private business but slowly, through my service, I realised the seriousness of the housing need and then I started to serve in this area and changed my career.

The housing situation in Ethopia is one of the worst in the world. More than 90% of the people live in substandard housing conditions and 30% of homes do not have water and people have to fetch it from a distance, and 40% of the houses do not have toilet facilities and people have to find other places for sanitation services. Having see it the reality is highly painful.

As members are aware, housing is critical for human beings and is a place of dignity. Families and people who do not have houses cannot have dignity. Housing is the beginning of everything. It is the beginning of development, it is the beginning of growth and education. Because of this housing is one of the strongest instruments in breaking the cycle of poverty and, unfortunately, we live in a world that has not given adequate attention to housing. Because of this, millions of people continue to live in unacceptable conditions around the world. Poverty housing can be characterised by a number of things - houses that are leaking and have stains on the outside, houses that can collapse at any time and unbelievable overcrowding.

Habitat for Humanity started in 1993. We have served 14,000 families or 70,000 persons in the country and have diversified our services. We have started serving vulnerable families and have introduced different innovative interventions in our work, one of which is improving construction in order that it can be done all the year round and cannot be affected by the weather or change of seasons and that we can built from local materials in cheaper ways. When we compare the economic benefit of the newly introduced improved house, we have served more than 83,000 boxes of cement or US$930,000 which is equivalent to 13 million Ethiopian birr by constructing 1,660 houses.

I wish to share one story among many similar ones where family's life has changed a great deal. Mr. Levin and his wife were affected by leprosy in their area of Ethiopia. Before becoming beneficiaries of Habitat for Humanity they were living in plastic sheds, in an isolated place and were stigmatised. They earned their living by begging. After they got a habitat house they started to earn their living by working. Their life has improved. Mr. Levin said he was 65 years old but since he got a habitat house five years ago, he said he is now a five year old person not a 65 year old person. Also on 25 January 2014, when we were giving home ownership certificates he said:

I begged for 35 years, I never thought there was anything better than begging but since getting work and since getting a Habitat house I have completely changed. Now I am opposed to begging. I am proud to start living my life actively by earning through my work.

Ethiopia does not have a housing policy and a housing ministry, and because of this, housing has not been given attention, and that makes our work a lot more difficult. To date, we celebrate serving 70,000 people and we have introduced housing for vulnerable groups. We are grateful that we have managed to do this with the support of Ireland. However, the need is still great. We hope that we continue to increase our support. I thank the committee members for giving me this golden opportunity.

Mr. Vincent Cunningham:

First, we call on the joint committee to use its influence to encourage the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, and Irish Aid in particular, to prioritise funding and support for governments and civil society organisations to develop and implement innovative shelter programmes that are appropriate and sustainable to the housing needs of the world's poor. Second, we call on the committee to use Ireland's voice to promote housing policies and interventions that bring about lasting systemic change and challenge the root causes of families being forced to live in inadequate housing. This includes discussions on the post-2015 development agenda, in which Habitat for Humanity calls for shelter to be included as an explicit, measurable priority. Third, we call on the committee to promote opportunities for the Irish public to learn, engage and participate in global issues, including housing interventions.

Tonight and every night, more than 1.6 billion people will be forced to sleep standing up when it rains because they do not have a decent roof. They will be constantly afraid of their safety because they do not have doors that lock. Safe shelter saves lives. Our work at Habitat for Humanity will not stop until everybody has a decent place to call home. This evening, as we all head home, we ask members to keep that in mind. Thank you for your time today.

Pat Breen (Clare, Fine Gael)
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I thank Mr. Cunningham and Mr. Abebe for their very interesting contributions. Sometimes we forget about where people live and the difficulties they have in finding a home.

Brendan Smith (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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I welcome the contributions and I compliment Habitat for Humanity on its work in many deprived communities. The figure of 1.6 billion people living in inadequate accommodation - to put it mildly - is a frightening statistic. The other statistic often quoted is that 1 billion people go to bed hungry every night. These two statistics are really a terrible indictment of the international community and communities across the world. With increasing urbanisation, the issues of food security, climate change and space for people to live in appropriate accommodation all need to be given more attention by the public. The briefing we got stated that we should promote opportunities for the Irish public to learn, engage and participate in global issues, including housing interventions. That is a welcome development. It is only at a time of crisis that there is adequate media coverage of the particular challenges facing so many communities worldwide. If we look at Sky News, BBC, RTE and other broadcasters, we hear about climate change due to the recent flooding in England. That is why it is getting more attention, but it should get attention at all times. With increasing urbanisation, there is less land available for arable purposes and the production of food, and issues such as this need great attention.

Am I right in thinking that Habitat for Humanity advocates on behalf of the many communities in which people are living in slum conditions, and is also a provider of housing? Does the organisation get support through the international development aid programmes of different countries and of the European Union? Its work is extremely important and I hope it can create a better awareness of those statistics quoted in its briefing paper.

Seán Crowe (Dublin South West, Sinn Fein)
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I thank the witnesses for their presentation. The briefing note stated that we are witnessing a massive population increase and said that by 2050, 70% of the world's population would be living in urban areas, with up to 2 billion people living in slums, with all the personal, health, social and economic ramifications of that. I know that Habitat for Humanity works to construct, rehabilitate and preserve housing, but does it also work with government and state agencies to improve urban planning? Is that part of its ambit, or is that beyond its resources? I am conscious that the population increases; it is not just about building houses, but where and how to build them and whether they are sustainable in the long run.

The importance of housing is detailed extremely well in the presentation. We know that Irish Aid focuses primarily on hunger and health. Do the witnesses feel that Irish Aid is doing enough to prioritise the issue of housing? What could it do better? The witnesses suggested that perhaps the Government here could promote shelter programmes. Does Habitat for Humanity do any work with UN-HABITAT? That agency is mandated by the UN General Assembly to promote socially and environmentally sustainable towns and cities. Do the witnesses feel it is achieving that goal? Does UN-HABITAT work adequately with NGOs? Does Irish Aid work with UN-HABITAT?

References were made to housing crises, decent housing and so on. We do not have to look far to find that. There is a crisis in this country. It is not on the same scale, but it is difficult to say that to families who are living in sub-standard accommodation, without proper heating. I know of a family in my own constituency who have no electricity at the moment. I had a woman in my office yesterday who was being bullied in her accommodation, but at 59 years of age she has no prospect of moving out because she does not have the deposit to move. While people will welcome our involvement in projects around the world, we also need to balance our views on what is happening in our own country. It is important that there is a voice for such people. We want to see safe, secure housing, free from intimidation, but we also want to see that in Ireland. It would be remiss if we did not state that there is a huge crisis in this country. I carried out a survey yesterday in my own constituency about people trying to get housing supplement. Of 77 households in the area looking for the supplement, 73 are over the limit, while two of the remaining owners do not accept the supplement. There is no way forward for people in such situations. There is no social housing coming through, nor is anything coming through via NAMA.

I welcome the work being done by Habitat for Humanity. It is positive and we need to support it, but we also need to look at what we are doing in our own country.

Maureen O'Sullivan (Dublin Central, Independent)
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I welcome the deputation. It was interesting to hear about the work they do. Like other people, my original perception was that Habitat for Humanity was involved with housing in the developing world, as opposed to our world, until I learned some years ago of its work here. One thing for the committee to examine is how shelter should be included in housing policy after the period of the millennium development goals. This is vital because, as the deputation said, it is easily measurable. I have two particular questions. Within the countries in which Habitat for Humanity is based, what type of funding does it get? Do any of the countries assist in the organisation's projects?

I know of the involvement of Habitat for Humanity with Dublin City Council. The deputation referred to being part of the solution. In practical terms, how does the deputation envisage this? I know of some of the work that Habitat for Humanity is doing - for example, the housing in Inchicore. As Deputy Crowe said, there is a major problem with housing in the Dublin Central area and other areas around Dublin. We are seeing substandard housing being let out for private rented accommodation. We can also see the number of voids that are left in the local authority areas. I am unsure whether there is a role for Habitat for Humanity in this regard. I know that the organisation renovates, but is there scope for a more direct engagement with Dublin City Council, given that the deputation said the organisation could be part of the solution?

Some youth groups in my area have been part of the organisation's projects. They have been to Paraguay and Romania. The groups were made up of young people, some of whom are foreign nationals, along with local Dublin boys and girls. They went out to build houses. It is one of those experiences that defines people when they come back and it was a great opportunity for them to do that.

Olivia Mitchell (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
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I thank the deputation for the presentations. I was trying to get my head around what exactly the organisation does during the presentation. It was only when the deputation came to the recommendations that I began to get a handle on what exactly Habitat for Humanity is really trying to achieve. Reference was made to housing solutions in Ethiopia. I was interested to hear that the organisation has produced a template for sustainable housing using local materials. That has relevance in the village or a small town, but does it have relevance in a city? Deputy Crowe touched on this point. Is the organisation adverting to a planning function? Does it work through Governments? How does Habitat for Humanity ensure that it deals with planning? I have in mind countries such as India or the South American countries where there is already teeming humanity. In these countries people are still pouring into the cities and will continue to pour in for decades to come. At issue is how we plan cities, and it is a complex problem.

One of the recommendations of the deputation half-answers my question. The recommendation stated that Ireland should use its voice bilaterally and in international forums to promote housing policies and interventions that bring lasting systemic change. If only we could manage that ourselves we would do very well because planning is still a major issue in this country. Circumstances are constantly changing. The key is probably to work through individual countries and recognise that there are different solutions in different places. I would like this to be included as one of the objectives for the post-millennium development goals. Then it would be up to each country to concentrate on the issue and identify their intentions rather than simply have a wave of humanity continue to come into cities. Otherwise we will end up with the type of squalor and poverty that we still see so often. Is it really a planning issue that Habitat for Humanity is advocating, apart from the details relating to places such as Ethiopia and Dublin?

Eric Byrne (Dublin South Central, Labour)
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I welcome our visitors. I am somewhat familiar with Habitat for Humanity and I thank the deputation for remembering the day the President came out to open what was a fine old building that had been allowed to go into disrepair. In fact, I am keen go back and visit it along with some of the residents to see how they are settling in. The building was almost palatial in many ways, given the height of the Georgian ceilings. They were fine rooms and it was a fine house. I hope it is working out well.

We learn something new every day. I did not know Habitat for Humanity was receiving Irish Aid assistance. I am pleased because the committee often deals with the Irish Aid budget. The organisation has targeted projects in Zambia, which is very interesting.

I wish to ask the deputation about tenure agreements. My understanding is that the people in Inchicore might have got loans and made some financial or physical contribution by working on the building. Will the deputation explain a little about the relationship between potential tenants and owner-occupiers? Are the tenure arrangements the same internationally? I am unsure what happens in Ethiopia. Do housing associations run these properties there? Does everyone benefit from private ownership?

The scale of housing is relevant. We are familiar with Africa and the number of poor unfortunates who are emigrating illegally but who end up dead on beaches in Spain, Greece and other places. There are huge movements of people across the continent heading this way.

I am aware of some of the indigenous uses of natural resources, such as the interweaving of banana leaves and bamboo sticks in Africa, which is interesting. The deputation is saying that the organisation can accommodate or adapt traditional building methods with building materials, using a more modern way to create greater security, sanitation and so on. I am keen to hear how good these programmes are. Habitat for Humanity is in 70 countries, which is fantastic. Are they all stand-alone? Is Habitat for Humanity a housing association, as we understand it, like Clúid or Oaklee? How does Habitat for Humanity differs from the other housing associations working in Ireland?

David Norris (Independent)
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I thank the Chairman and I welcome Mr. Cunningham and Mr. Abebe. One of the figures that struck me was that the total slum population is doubling to 2 billion, a horrifying figure. I fully support what Habitat for Humanity is doing. I believe the situation of the planet is going to get worse and worse unless, in parallel with all these things, we confront the appalling population explosion that has taken place. The planet simply cannot sustain it. We are wasting our time if we do not address it.

I launched Green Week in Trinity College on Monday of this week. When I was in Trinity College the total population of the university was 3,000, but it is now 21,000, seven times higher. Since I was born the population has almost trebled on the planet. We cannot keep doing that. Only providing houses is not a solution because there will be more and more people and we are going to be unable to keep up. In tandem, something must be done about population. People are afraid to touch the topic. All the great religions want to breed and breed because to them it is a numbers game - if one religion has more members then another then their God is right and so on. It is a load of baloney. Each year I go to the United Nations launch of the report on global population. The one word we never find in the report is "population". The report refers to women in conflict, educating children and female circumcision but it will not discuss population. Why? It is what is underneath the tension, the wars, housing problems and everything.

I congratulate Habitat for Humanity because what the organisation has done is absolutely wonderful. I am far less interested in what the organisation does in this country than what it does in other countries because I believe we should be able to look after ourselves. It is our responsibility. We have vast resources and we should not be whinging or bellyaching. I am sometimes ashamed, in the area of the city that I live in, when I see the way people behave on social welfare, coming down in dirty, soiled pyjamas, buying trays of booze and wheeling them around in prams. I compare that with what I saw in Nairobi. I saw people living with sewage going through their houses, with tin roofs and no furniture.

They send their children out absolutely immaculate. They have respect for themselves and look wonderful. I look at people from Nigeria or Ethiopia walking the streets of inner city Dublin and wonder what they must think of us, with all we have, giving that we behave in such a horrible slovenly way. I have seen the overcrowded rooms with dirty floors, poor ventilation and unsanitary living conditions and salute the people who, despite these appalling conditions, live so nobly, humanly and decently.

I congratulate and say, "Well done," to Habitat for Humanity for helping more than 4 million people to construct, rehabilitate or preserve homes since 1976. That is a fantastic record and we all stand in admiration of it.

I do not mean to blaggard all the people in my area or all the poor people in Dublin-----

Seán Crowe (Dublin South West, Sinn Fein)
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Or all those on social welfare.

David Norris (Independent)
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Or all those on social welfare. I face the reality of what I see every day. I have always believed in speaking the truth and do not care a damn whether it causes trouble.

There are three recommendations which seem to be perfectly reasonable and in tandem with the objectives of the Government and the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade. I have no difficulty with any of them. It would strengthen our hand if we could pass them to the Department as an indicator of our support. There is nothing controversial in them. As they do not call for specific expenditure, the Department of Finance will not get into a tizzy over them. They suggest using our voice to prioritise and promote housing policies, lasting systemic change and opportunities for ourselves as a people to learn about our brothers and sisters throughout the world who face these difficulties. This kind of learning programme is extremely important, if we can get it into schools. It might even affect our own behaviour in the future. If the Chairman and my colleagues agree, I suggest we take this as a note, stating we agree and support it, and refer it to the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I thank our guests for coming before the joint committee. They have touched on a very important subject, to which there are two aspects: developing and developed countries which are very different. I have been deeply involved for quite a long time in improving housing conditions. In this country many thousands of people are virtually homeless because of the situation that has been evolving for several years. Serious forward planning is required in dealing with housing provision, at least ten years in advance. There is no sense in trying to do it a year or two years in advance. In developing countries one has the advantage of providing good quality housing from the beginning on what is virtually a greenfield site. It is easier and more cost-effective to do it that way. We can learn from experience. It is very easy to obtain dramatic results in a short space of time, using a multiplicity of agencies, taking advantage of aid and the natural environment which can be helpful or unhelpful. Development in the United States takes place in Roman-type grids with straight lines which are simple to follow. We do not like that system in this country and did not take that route. In the United States they started with greenfield sites and used all of the knowledge and information available from Roman times. We have forgotten some of the basic things learned during years, particularly about irrigation, as was seen during the flooding in the United Kingdom. Modern engineers have forgotten these things.

I have been deeply opposed to the emergence of voluntary housing. This is not a shot at Habitat for Humanity, but 15 years ago I predicted that it would fail to address the issues involved and it did. There was a tendency which remains to some extent to provide public authority housing by using the semi-private sector, but that did not work for a multiplicity of reasons. We are now in the situation about which my colleagues have talked and it is too late, as the crisis is upon us. Some like-minded colleagues and I have spoken about it in the House. I was castigated in the media for some of the things I had said in the House 15 years ago, but these issues come back to bite us eventually and we are now trying to patch up a crisis which is not so easy to do. Everybody believes there are houses available, that the National Asset Management Agency has them, but we do not have them in the places where they are needed, where the population is. They are in other parts of the country where the population does not require such accommodation. Sadly, the forward planning was appalling and we now have to live with it.

A few years ago at the peak of the boom I was involved in a local authority initiative to provide affordable housing for people on the local authority housing list. We built approximately 100 houses. Unlike the private voluntary housing association, we did not get the sites for free or €1 each; we had to pay €25,000 for them. We were able to build houses on these sites from the local authorities for between €135,000 and €175,000. When they were sold to the tenants, they were on the market at between €390,000 and €420,000. That gives one an idea of the nonsense that was going on and we knew full well what was happening. There was a lot of profiteering in the business. The State moved away from providing houses for people from industrial wage level down, those who would ordinarily qualify for local authority housing, because it was too much trouble to provide them. That was a woeful mistake and the consequences are now being felt. It is a serious crisis.

To go back to the Romans - Senator David Norris would be an expert in this area because he soldiered with them - it is important to remember that as the standard of living and the quality of life increase in every civilisation, the population falls; whether we like it, that is the way it happens.

David Norris (Independent)
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It does not.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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It does actually. In countries that are highly developed there are no huge families; for economic reasons there are small families. It is a fact of life and beyond doubt that family size reduces automatically. I want to finish with the Romans, again for Senator David Norris’s benefit.

David Norris (Independent)
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It was the Greeks.

Seán Crowe (Dublin South West, Sinn Fein)
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Deputy Bernard J. Durkan has crossed the Rubicon.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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We failed to inherit what the Romans had learned 2,000 years ago to the extent that we should have had. As planners, we failed to learn what we should have from what they had learned. They were good engineers. They introduced sanitation, running water, air conditioning-----

David Norris (Independent)
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They invented concrete.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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-----and concrete - you name it - they did it very effectively. They were able to provide services for a growing population in a way no one else had ever done. Whatever housing is provided in the future should have a long lifespan. The recent nonsense about temporary or short-term housing which was an immediate response to a crisis did not work.

Providing long-term sustainable housing is a preferable option. Buildings have been standing for 500 and 1,000 years if properly put together yet in Priory Hall, homes were falling apart after six months. I apologise for that outburst.

Pat Breen (Clare, Fine Gael)
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No problem, Deputy, you had some assistance from Senator Norris.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I am always willing to assist.

Dan Neville (Limerick, Fine Gael)
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I welcome the delegation and I thank them for the presentation. The work of the group is very valuable. I have seen the slums and shanty towns in Lusaka, Windhoek and Johannesburg. One has to see the conditions of the houses and the sanitation to fully understand how people live. In many cases, just next to the shanty towns there is a lot of wealth on view. In Lusaka the head of the air force lives near a shanty town and he would not even allow people to use his water and they had to travel elsewhere. What kind of commitment is given by the official states? We often detect a sense of detachment from government representatives with regard to this type of good work. Many NGOs have experienced this attitude in the Third World. We saw how GOAL works with homeless children in Lusaka who are quick to respond to training and to the provision of decent human living conditions. They learn to help themselves. There has been quite a lot of growth in Ethiopia even though this is from a low base. How much of the new wealth is put towards alleviating the conditions that Habitat for Humanity wants to address?

Pat Breen (Clare, Fine Gael)
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I will give the delegation plenty of time to answer all the questions. I am sure all the witnesses will have something to say in reply

Mr. Vincent Cunningham:

I thank the members for the positive comments. Habitat for Humanity is about both advocacy and building. We are a global organisation operating in 70 countries around the world. Circumstances differ from one country to another, in particular between countries in the developed world such as Ireland as against Ethiopia or Zambia, where we run a programme along with Irish Aid. We believe in people having their own homes and a decent place to live. We require them to buy into that option in whichever way they can, whether that is through sweat, equity or by purchasing the properties provided by us. It is not a hand-out. They are required to put work and effort into gaining ownership of the houses. We are a global organisation and the circumstances differ depending on the country. Funding resources are different. The organisation receives government funding in some countries. In the case of Ireland we work in co-operation with Irish Aid on the programme in Zambia. Irish Aid provides the majority of the funding and we match it. Other countries have different models.

A number of members raised the issue of urban planning. We are an advocacy organisation and we look to try to change policy in different countries. Ms McCann can talk about our land tenure programme, a global advocacy campaign which we are launching.

Ms Jeannie McCann:

Habitat for Humanity believes that everyone is equal rather than some people being regarded as disadvantaged. We know we can never solve the situation of 1.6 billion people living in poor housing by just building or renovating houses or even by sending volunteers; the situation requires many different housing interventions. We can serve many more families by influencing policy. Our global colleagues in Habitat International recently conducted a survey across the 70 countries in which Habitat works. It asked each country to name the biggest obstacles in implementing the programmes. By far the biggest obstacle was land tenure and the securing of land. An example of where Habitat has worked to positively influence land tenure is in Haiti. After the earthquake there was widespread devastation and millions of people were displaced, lost their homes and their lives were shattered. However, the earthquake did not just cause a disaster, it revealed one. The country had no building codes and land policies were very blurred. The Ministry responsible for land was destroyed by the earthquake so all the title deeds of land ownership were destroyed and chaos ensued. Habitat led a coalition of partners that included other NGOs, UN Habitat and many funding organisations and governments, including the United States and French Governments. The coalition was an attempt to define the process of how land can be secured and how those policies were to be put in place. To date, several manuals have been compiled in French, English and Creole to help local people understand how to secure land and to clarify how land can be secured.

In Zambia our programme is supported by Irish Aid and security of tenure is one of the key objectives of the programme. Habitat does not build houses on land that the homeowner cannot own. In Ethiopia and in Zambia there are many problems to do with traditional norms. For example, women are excluded from owning land and may not know their rights. We put in a lot of work in advocating so that women are aware of their rights and they cannot be evicted on the death of a husband.

Our colleagues in Habitat International work very closely with UN Habitat. We are involved with the working group on post-2015 currently meeting to include shelter as a measurable explicit link in the post-2015 development agenda. It was only mentioned as a small target in the previous millennium development goals which was to decrease the number of slum-dwellers by 100 million but the reality is that slums continue to grow. That target was not relevant.

Habitat regards its work as being part of the solution, not all of the solution. We are very committed to working with other partners to ensure that the solution is holistic. This means working with partners in Zambia on GOAL feeding programmes or with partners in Ethiopia to deliver eco stoves so that families can have better health.

Mr. Abebe will answer the question about the benefits and challenges of working with the Government of Ethiopia.

Mr. Kebede Abebe:

We work with the Government of Ethiopia but the government does not involve us in its planning. The NGOs are regarded as a kind of service-provider and gap-filler. That is how we are regarded. In most cases as government observes our work the relationship has grown stronger over time.

In most cases, on the basis of the work we do, the relationship has grown stronger over time, which is very encouraging. In the case of the slum upgrading we do in Addis Ababa, for example, the different offices of the Government have provided a range of supports, from giving us building permits to providing locations for the storage of materials.

There is an issue in terms of planning. In the case of the slums of Addis Ababa, as it stands we are basically performing a firefighting exercise, trying to keep the houses from falling down on the people. The idea of planning becomes a type of luxury and we can only prioritise the repair of dwellings. Ultimately, however, there has to be a long-term solution to this generational issue. That is why we are appealing to the committee to help us, as members of the international community, by adding their voice to ours. We are hoping the Irish Government will encourage governments in places like my country to give the issue of housing greater attention. Domestic effort is critical but, unfortunately, encouragement must come from countries like Ireland.

There was a question around the sustainability, durability and quality of the houses we built. We are trying to optimise quality relative to cost, while taking account of practical issues and the question of deliverability. At the moment, the option we have taken is to make improvements to the traditional construction systems. Houses are built mostly from soil and wood, but people fail to do proper cladding and foundations. This is where we have focused our improvements and they have been very successful. Certainly, these houses are much more durable than concrete or brick houses. They do not require a special foundation; because of their elastic nature, they can be built on settling soils, hard rocks and so on. The quality control requirement in that regard is not too intensive.

We are aware of the importance of durability. We do not build houses to last five, ten years or even 20 years. That time is over before one knows it. Sustainability is another issue but we are also making it happen. Regarding the quality of engineering work, it is an issue of concern to me. I am always very concerned about engineering education and practice. It is a question of making engineers aware of the importance of serving poor people by providing them with housing. My experience is that they are there to serve better-off people. I was agonised by how poor people live, so I forced myself to change career and become involved in the service of the poor.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I am very interested in Mr. Abebe's comments because I have studied this particular issue for many years. In respect of the durability of the housing units, I realise different countries have different traditions, but if one is spending money in today's economic climate, value for money and cost benefit analyses have to come into it. In the case of shanty town or slum reconstructions, to what extent is preference given to a greenfield development alongside the original site? It is far cheaper to start afresh on a greenfield site than to attempt to overhaul an existing tumbledown structure where the money will not go any distance at all.

In regard to durability, I am not sure whether the witnesses have been involved in the reconstruction effort in Haiti, to give a classic example, or more recently in the Philippines, two areas which suffered very significant devastation. Members of the committees have visited various locations in recent years where there is a clear urgency, in appalling slum conditions, to provide a reasonable quality of housing. How people remain calm in those situations I will never understand. They are a breeding ground for social unrest. It is a fundamental right of human beings to have reasonable accommodation in which to live. It is about treating people with some type of dignity. Durability is an important aspect of that, recognising that in some areas, residents of housing of a less durable nature have suffered very heavily, whereas more durable dwellings have been better able to withstand natural disaster shocks.

Mr. Kebede Abebe:

I thank the Vice Chairman for his very good questions. We take both approaches in serving people in severely slum conditions - mostly reconstruction but also moving some into greenfield areas. In some locations, the Government gives us open areas on which to build. They are nicely built, durable houses constructed in rows. We do not have storms such as those that occur in Haiti, but the dwellings are built to withstand prevailing conditions. In my service of 12 years, there was only one case where the roof of a house was blown away. We discovered it was partly a result of workmanship in that specific case. In general, however, the houses we have built are withstanding the elements.

As I said, the work we do in slum areas is largely renovation. It is essentially firefighting to save people's lives today. There is no long-term planning; it is about putting a roof on people's houses. The new houses we construct are durable - designed to last at least half a century, according to our estimation. Repair of these houses using the same materials will not be difficult or costly. Our objective is to ensure they are easily repairable, cost effective, manageable, easily extended and not susceptible to soil conditions. They are good quality solutions and the repayments people make are used to build houses for other families. There is an affordability issue here. If we propose to build brick houses, for instance, people will not be able to afford them. This is another justification for adopting indigenous construction.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I apologise for prolonging matters. It was stated that the people cannot afford to build brick houses. Can the Government afford to build them? When this State was founded, its people could not afford what was required. As a result, the State had to intervene directly. The Chairman has indicated a desire to return to the meeting. As a result, I must remain in situ until he does so. I apologise for that and I know members are becoming impatient.

Some members of the committee visited Sierra Leone, while others travelled to Ghana. I know a little about construction despite the fact that I was never directly involved in it. In that context, if I were given the task of putting items of infrastructure in place in Sierra Leone, I would find it difficult to do so with the population still in situ. I refer to the fact that are no footpaths, street lighting, sanitary services or water system, roads, etc., in certain areas. In short, it is absolute desolation. In order to provide the services required by a modern society in such circumstances, a different approach is going to be required. In my opinion, they would need to be provided from scratch on a greenfield site in order that one would not be obliged to circumnavigate the difficulties which unfortunately exist at present. I accept that members wish to attend other meetings but I am obliged to keep proceedings going until the Chairman returns.

Ms Jeannie McCann:

As stated earlier, we worked in Haiti for 25 years before the earthquake and we continue to work there. We are committed to helping to rebuild the country. Equally, we have been working in the Philippines for 25 years. Before Typhoon Haiyan hit, we had served 26,000 families through disaster response and mitigation alone. We are using our pathways-to-permanence housing model in the Philippines. We have already distributed 30,000 emergency shelter kits to families affected by Typhoon Haiyan. We need to move towards more permanent solutions and we recently secured land from the Filipino Government in order that we might start building. Just last week we broke ground on the first housing projects relating to this land. The houses that are going to be constructed there will be disaster resilient. As a testament to how disaster-resilient they are, similar houses were located in areas where the typhoon hit and none was destroyed or damaged.

Pat Breen (Clare, Fine Gael)
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I apologise for my absence. I was obliged to go to the Dáil in order to raise an issue. I sincerely thank our guests for their contributions and members for their questions. Our guests have really enlightened us with regard to the role their organisation plays. It is important for members to know what it does in the context of housing. Mr. Cunningham referred to Habitat for Humanity operating in 70 countries. Does it operate in the Americas and Asia?

Mr. Vincent Cunningham:

Yes. We operate in 70 countries in all regions across the globe. As Ms McCann just indicated, we have spent the past 25 years working in Haiti and the Philippines. Obviously, massive devastation occurred in both of these countries in recent times.

Pat Breen (Clare, Fine Gael)
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I again thank our guests for coming before us. We look forward to maintaining contact with them in order that they might brief us in respect of their continuing work for the people they house, particularly in the context of the successes they achieve.

Mr. Vincent Cunningham:

I thank the Chairman. We would welcome the opportunity to maintain contact with the committee.

Pat Breen (Clare, Fine Gael)
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I did not have an opportunity earlier to deal with the minutes of our previous meeting. The draft minutes of the meeting of 12 February 2014 have been circulated to members. Are they agreed? Agreed. We will now go into private session to discuss a number of matters.