Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
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How much of what a RGDATA retailer stocks is determined by the wholesaler and how much is supplied by a food processor? Can an independent retailer make a deal with the wholesaler? We are concerned not just with price of foodstuffs but the conditions for sourcing products. My understanding with liquid milk is that if there is a surplus in the North, it comes to the South and southern farmers get displaced and vice versa.

I am told food prices in Ireland are higher compared with most other EU member states. I am also told the multiples will charge more in the South rather than in Northern Ireland and that there is quite a considerable price differential. I would be interested in any light that RGDATA could throw on this issue and how it comes about. We are all on the one island and one would imagine there are the same transport costs to bring in food products to the island.

We need a code of practice with teeth. The points made by RGDATA are very salient to the way this plays out, particularly if the multiples are imposing huge conditions which the supplier has to claw back. When we refer to the supplier, are we referring to the farmer, the processor or the wholesaler? The committee is trying to gather information to get an understanding of the dynamics at play here.

We all agree that there needs to be much greater emphasis on labelling, making it easy to read and understand. If a product is declared to be Irish, it should be Irish. I understand there are many challenges in this area because of country of origin rules. There are more problems with processed foods because inevitably they are imported products. This is an area that needs to be examined and RGDATA's views on this are important.

There is an effort in America to establish who is getting what out of food products. Is it the primary producer, the transporter, the processor or the retailer? I know this process has been flawed but a flawed system is better than no system. As RGDATA rightly pointed out, we simply do not know who is getting what out of the final consumer price for the food. Without that information, we are at a loss. We need to gather a whole lot of information on what is going on with this sector. We need to get an understanding of the dynamics of the trade and see its various parts. We then need to propose actions which would come under four headings. First, the public should know the truth of what actually happens in this sector. Second, we should create public awareness about the importance of quality products and labelling. Third, we should take legal action in Ireland, rather than wait for the EU train, to bring in a statutory code of practice. I understand the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation is proposing a Bill in this regard.

We should also consider whether there are other legal issues that would result in a change here. The figures for some of the multiples are bigger than those for countries and states. At an EU level there is considerable interest, but the problem is getting the juggernaut to actually do something. This issue should be tackled and if various states do not tackle it at state level, it will not be put on the EU agenda. Ultimately, we are interested in two aspects. Clearly, the committee is interested in primary food producers. However, it is fair to say we are interested in the consumer also and the consumer needs to be given a guarantee. If there is not a decent margin, the consumer cannot be guaranteed high quality safe food that we can and will continue to produce on this island into the distant future. We should take a long-term perspective and recognise that the processes of the wholesalers and retailers are important and legitimate links in the chain. We have to strike the optimum balance between the various sectors; it is not a case of one against the other, rather we need a balance to get everyone to take a long-term view, which suggests that if we could achieve such a balance, it would be best for Irish society.

I referred to the milk issue. Life, politics and the media are funny. I issued a press release on the matter and someone raised the issue with me of ugly fruit and vegetables; in other words, the question of supermarkets being unwilling to sell irregular sized vegetables and so on. I remember giving prominence in the press release to the challenges being faced by liquid milk producers. However, in the public mind and most of the media the ugly fruit story is far easier to sell than the idea of liquid milk producers being under significant pressure. That will only become a story when there is no liquid milk in the shop one day in January.

There is a subset. We are dealing with the issue of major commodities being placed on the shelves by the various suppliers. We are also interested in micro artisan food producers, with whom I was involved in a previous life as a Minister. I am aware of the important part they can play in selling to high quality food shops such as those the delegation represents. It is a matter of getting a toe-hold in the market and setting up a small niche artisan food business offering high quality produce. We used to work with such businesses in terms of the HACCP and so on. The delegation represents those involved in a particular niche market which has a reputation and in which I am interested.

There is an issue with fruit and vegetables and so on because there is a need to be able to say where they have been grown. Certain issues arise for the delegation in terms of seasonality, standards and so on. Is there something we could do to make it easier for local shops such as those the delegation represents to buy local produce? What challenges do RGDATA members face, especially those tied to large wholesalers? What is the extent of the challenges they face in terms of their discretion to buy local produce such as fruit and vegetables?