Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Tuesday, 18 December 2012

Joint Oireachtas Committee on European Union Affairs

Exchange of Views with Mr. Egemen Bagis, Turkish Minister for Europe and Principal Turkish Negotiator for EU Membership.

2:50 pm

Mr. Egemen Bagis:

I thank the members for their constructive comments and questions. Regarding the economic crisis, no crisis lasts forever and every crisis eventually comes to an end. In 1999 and 2001, Turkey had 8,000% interest rates between banks overnight. We had a single day in our history when the country's president and prime minister had a major argument where the president threw a printed copy of the constitution at the face of the prime minister. That night our stock market plunged and the banks started charging each other 8,000% interest rates overnight. However, for the past five years Turkey has been the most stable and fastest-growing economy in Europe. Things change. It takes fiscal discipline, commitment and confidence, but it changes. Despite the economic crisis, per capita prosperity in Europe is higher than in anywhere else in the world.

While I accept Ireland has 14% or 15% unemployment, at least people still have hope. Ireland's food hygiene standards are better than most of the world. People are not afraid getting sick as a result of eating something in a restaurant. Ireland's school system functions very well and the health system functions. Ireland has some set policies in terms of its citizens' access to public services. It has what it takes to turn this around. It will take some time but it will happen. That is why we are so committed. We feel that we are part of Europe. Some 50% of our foreign trade is with the EU.

Some 85% of all international investments and 92% of new technology in my country comes from the EU. Turkey is a full member of every European organisation, including EUFOR, the European Investment Bank, European security and defence policies and participates in the Eurovision but it is still only a negotiating member of the EU. Two Turkish princes were called "Europe" and "Paris".

What unites us is much greater than that which divides us. Historically, it was believed that Turkey was too large. Now being a big country presents a great opportunity for a European economy because big markets are needed to deal with the current status. It is no longer accurate to say Turkey is too poor because it is now one of the most dynamic economies. The argument that Turkey is a Muslim country is now advantageous because of the need to send out a clear message to the 1.5 billion Muslims around the world that the EU is not anti-Islam, in particular to the 35 million Muslims who live in today's EU as rightful citizens. More than 10% of the population of France are Muslim. The ratio of Muslims in Germany is approximately the same and is growing in many other countries not only through migration but by choice. I believe Turkey can play an important role in this regard. For more than 200 years we have successfully coexisted the culture of Islam with the culture of democracy.

On the point made by Deputy Dowds in regard to Turkey's neighbours, no country gets to choose its neighbours. As problematic as they are, we would be willing to change neighbours with Ireland if we had the choice. However, we cannot. I wish Switzerland was a neighbour of Turkey. Peace, prosperity and democracy can be also contagious. I believe that Turkish economic development and its success story is a part of the foundation of the Arab spring-awakening. Without giving in on our values we changed things, which people in our neighbourhood saw. The Turkish Prime Minister can pray with the local people in Libya and can, on coming out of the mosque, tell them not to be afraid of secularism. Being secular does not necessarily mean one has abandoned one's religion. Being secular ensures everyone has the right to practise his or her religion of choice. If the European Union really represents peace and understanding among different nations, ethnicities, religions and cultures this message is very much needed in today's Syria, Egypt, Iraq, Iran and so on. Turkey is trying to deliver that message.

The Syrian people were mentioned. More than 150,000 Syrians have found shelter in Turkey. We have spent more than €400 million in the past year trying to meet the expenses of these people. This is not an issue which we can address on our own. We need to work together on this and to convince our Russian colleagues not to support a dictator who is killing his own people and bombing his own cities. When it comes to Syria, the Turkish government has prioritised humanitarian values over its national interest. Turkey was the first Muslim country to call on Mubarak to leave office, as it did in respect of Gadaffi. Our national interest could have diverted us to look the other way and continue with our trade but the problem would then have become only more complicated and would have hurt us all.

The economic crisis will not last forever. Does this affect our public opinion? It does not affect us as much as hearing people like Sarkozy insult us. My countrymen are much more influenced by the negative attitude from Europe towards Turkey's membership aspirations. We know the economic crisis will one day be over and that to achieve this we will have to work together. However, the feeling of indifference and the insulting attitude are more relevant. We want fair treatment. The fact that Turkey is a great nation should not be a reason for it to receive any special favours from Europe but it should also not receive any special burdens from it. We want to be dealt with like all other candidate countries were dealt with. That 17 of 20 chapters are being politically blocked does not make sense. The Turkish people are the only citizens of any candidate country who need to apply for visas before visiting the Schengen region, which also does not make sense. As a Minister of the Turkish Government I had to apply for a visa to come to Dublin, which is not right. I can go to the United Kingdom without a visa and can visit all of the other 26 countries with a diplomatic passport. Ireland should not be the only sore thumb. I would welcome the committee's support in this regard.