Maeve O'Connell (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)

I welcome the language Ms Costello used regarding the need to move to an education system that is more circular. I would go further; we need to move to a system that is more of a matrix, meaning students can do this, or that, and come back, and move around the board in that way. I also welcome Ms Costello's comments on career guidance, which is really important. We need to resource that and get students more familiar with the fact that they are going into a world of lifelong learning and it is not that they just go on to further education and that is it, and then continue working in that space regardless. That is still very much part of the narrative out there and the expectation among the student body. I was a third level lecturer in Technological University Dublin before I was elected. I am very familiar with the challenges we have with the student body.

My first question is on apprentices. One of the challenges I have come across is that it is more challenging for an individual young person to engage with the apprenticeship system, rather than just filling out the CAO form from one to ten. My classes certainly had people there because it was the easy option. Then, of course, it did not suit them. That then affected their mental health and they were unsuccessful, so they had to come back into the system again. One is managing these challenges with these young people. From the perspective of representing employers, what can we do to enable employers to make it easier? Effectively, we are asking young people at the moment to go to an employer and ask them to take them on. If parents have not managed to get their 18-year olds to get a part-time job because they are too scared about that level of engagement, then asking them to go down the apprentice route gets them nowhere. The parents know that their 18-year-olds learn by being hands-on but they cannot make them deal with an employer to engage. From the perspective of representing employers, what can be done to encourage them, or what do we need to do to change that process so we can make it easier for 18-year-olds to engage rather than just filling in the CAO form, as they are doing?

My other question is about the National Training Fund. I have a list of suggestions from Ms Costello as to how we can utilise that fund, and that is terrific. We need to use it for its original purpose, which was to help provide skills that employers need. As all witnesses pointed out, we are dealing with a rapidly changing workplace, and we will need that fund to enable people to acquire those skills. How can we allow the employer's voice in that process? Ms Costello recommended the "employer's voice". How does she see that operating?