Seán Fleming (Laois, Fianna Fail)

Before we conclude, I want to put a few quick points to the witnesses. This is a new committee. It is the first time there has been a committee for infrastructure and capital projects. We want to ensure delivery. We want to start from a base of information. All of us know that projects always take longer and cost more. The best way for us to judge what we are doing is to have baseline figures. That will help everybody involved, across the Government and the Oireachtas, to understand what is going on here.

Various projects were mentioned in the Department's opening statement. There was a list of investments under the NDP, including the N4 Collooney scheme. I will not mention the rest of the projects but Mr. Doocey knows the paragraph to which I am referring.

Another paragraph of the opening statement referred to other road programmes and other N roads. There was mention of Ballaghaderreen, the M28 and the Adare bypass. Mr. Doocey mentioned the Athy southern relief road. He moved on to notable projects. For public transport, he mentioned BusConnects Dublin, the DART, the DART+ and the Donegal TEN-T. The appendix to the Department's submission included a big chart outlining the major road projects that are under construction, projects that are proceeding to construction, projects that are at the planning approval stage and projects that will go for planning approval in late 2025 or 2026. Over the page are projects that will proceed to planning in 2026 and 2027. There are also projects for which planning will be in the pipeline for 2028 to 2030. Some of those projects are now completed while others are under construction or are going for planning approval. Starting with the projects that have been completed, and I am only taking the projects listed by Mr. Doocey in his opening statement, I want a paragraph. When was each project first mooted? When was the first time the concept landed on a Minister's desk? I am not talking about a planning application, just the concept. When a project was first mooted in the Department or wherever else, what was the anticipated completed date? What was the estimated cost for the project on day one? I also want to know the actual completion date and final cost. I want the same for the projects that are currently in the system. What was the original cost estimate for each of those projects? What was the estimated timetable? For those projects that have not been completed, what is the estimated completion date and cost? I want the same exercise in respect of the other projects.

We at this committee, if we are to have any purpose and help the State and the Oireachtas, need that information. All we can judge future performance against is past performance. I want to see the accuracy of estimates at day one versus the outcome. That will give us an indication of how the system in Ireland actually works. At the start of a project, we can say we hope it will be completed in eight years' time. It might happen in eight years but just as easily, it might take 18 years. The cost could be ten times what was originally mooted. The project may have increased in complexity and the nature of the work may have expanded. We know all that. It is the nature of projects. However, it should have been known to some extent on day one. A project may grow from the estimates on day one. We can only judge past performance for all these projects if we have those yardsticks to go by. When witnesses such as those before the committee today come in with a new project with an estimated cost of €120 million that will be completed in six years, we can say that no other project has ever matched that timeline or original ballpark figure. We can use figures with lowball estimates. We get in a low figure, the project will creep through the system and we will have a decade to find the money as we go along. That does not help delivery or public confidence in how we do things in this country. If we have a yardstick to go by, we can measure things like that from now on.

I will move to bus stops. I want to know the ten most expensive and the ten most economical bus stops. Bus stops have gone into Laois. Some were excellently done and were simple and straightforward. Other bus stops required lorry loads of ready mix, tens of tonnes of concrete, long slipways and barriers. I know wheelchair accessibility requires an increase in height. Those bus stops must have cost a fortune. I am not saying the work did not need to be done, but people would like an indication when a new stop is being installed. I am sure the cost varies enormously. I can picture a few that I am talking about. I am sure one could build a house for the same price as some of the buses that have been installed on the basis of the amount of work I have seen going in. We want information on the bus stops that have been completed in the past 12, 18 or 24 months, whichever is convenient for the witnesses. We want the original estimate and the final cost. To be fair to our witnesses, we also want examples of bus stop projects that worked out to be very economical. I know they will tell us that there were factors such as road safety involved and we need to know that.

I will move to consider local matters. The N80 has been mentioned. It was mentioned by Deputy Lawlor in the important context of what has happened since Brexit. The N80, as the witnesses know, goes through the midlands. It goes through Abbeyleix, Portlaoise, Mountmellick and Tullamore, right through the midlands.

It is a very important route and traffic has increased enormously since Brexit. The problem in Mountmellick is that there is a narrow T junction and traffic cannot get around it. I know there was planning for a relief road a decade or 15 years ago and it fell through. An Bord Pleanála or somebody might have shot it down. Is there any plan for this now because traffic has increased enormously since then?

There are two final issues. One is extending the Leap card down to Portlaoise. It is being rolled out along the main line. I think it has come to Kildare and Monasterevin is probably along the route. The other issue - I am expecting a positive answer - is that the last train out of Dublin to Portlaoise is at approximately 10:15 p.m. There are 30 or so services from Portlaoise to Dublin. They start at 5.30 a.m., which is great. The carpark is usually full before 8 a.m. I do not know how you get parking near the train station. It is a sign of success that so many people are coming to take the train. That is a positive and a sign of success but we need a later train for people working late or who have a reason to be out late. We could do with one leaving Dublin after 11 p.m. I hope this can be in the next timetable.

I thank the witnesses for their time. We are here after 6 p.m. - we did have a vote - but I will let them come in now. In this committee, we want to be about our business. We are up and running a few weeks now and others have not complied so from now on, we want the answers received within two weeks. If the witnesses only have 80% of the answers, give us the 80% and the rest can follow a week or so later. We do not want in five weeks' time to have not received answers to anything. If it can all be done in a fortnight, well and good, but whatever can be sent within the fortnight, get it to us, and we will wait the other couple of weeks if we must for some of the more complicated answers.