David Cullinane (Waterford, Sinn Fein) | Oireachtas source

That is important and I will tell Mr. Gloster why. I got this under a freedom of information request. It is the minutes of the ministerial briefing from 23 March 2023. This is more for Mr. Watt because it talks about the national service plan, NSP, which we depend on, by the way, to ensure that it is accurate and all the information is provided. We need to understand what is happening in the Department. This was submitted to the Minister on 10 November. In the notes in the minutes of this meeting, it states:

A key element of this submission was concern with the level of financial risk within the Plan. A recommendation was issued to the HSE, under section 31(9) of the Health Act 2004, as amended, to amend the [national service plan] as follows:

a) To remove reference to potential funding shortfall or a requirement for a supplementary [budget] for 2023.

It goes on to state that the amended NSP was then sent again in March to the Department. It notes that it was shared with NSP contacts and the Department. It states:

A submission with a recommendation for approval subject to amendment of the NSP is being sent to the Minister. The main matters concerned in the letter to be issued are:

-A concern the revised NSP continues to highlight the material level of financial risk for 2023.

The witnesses can see why that would be concerning to me. We have the HSE crafting a national service plan, outlining the level of financial risk. It talked about a figure of more than €1 billion. The Department stated – it is in here as well – that it believed the real figure was somewhere between €400 million and €500 million. There was direction through the Minister that any reference to financial risk be removed from the national service plan and that was restated in March. I think that is an unacceptable way to approach this.

My question to Mr. Watt is: Was the HSE not right? Mr. Gloster is correct that it will be in the region of €1.1 billion. Mr. Watt’s Department’s estimation of €400 million to €500 million was grossly inaccurate. It was a mistake to ask the HSE to remove any reference to potential funding shortfall and the potential for a Supplementary Estimate, given that we now know there will be one.