Timmy Dooley (Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I have more comments than questions. To put my cards on the table, I fully support the approach being taken by the University of Limerick in its desire to have a veterinary school. I look at this in a number of ways. I will deal with the practical matters first.

At a time when Dublin is under enormous pressure in terms of growth and the provision of accommodation for students, UCD might put forward a good case because it has a centre that could be built onto, and others might say this sounds practical. However, we can go back to the principles established by Tom Parlon when he was Minister of State with responsibility for the OPW and Charlie McCreevy was Minister for Finance. They devolved projects outside of Dublin. It makes eminent sense to develop University of Limerick further and bring to it a discipline that is not there. If we believe in the principles of balancing development throughout the State, then Cork, Limerick or Galway should be considered. Limerick is looking for this. We will push for Limerick because of what has evolved there.

The ethos in Limerick is fantastic. It started out as a national institute for higher education. What it has succeeded in doing over a relatively short period is amazing. I did not attend the university, but I visit it on occasion for various events. I am always taken by the new developments, what it is about and where it is going. It is absolutely the right location and fits the bill in terms of regional development. I have already been lobbied and I am lobbying onwards for it to happen.

On the wider issue, I was brought up on a small farm. There was never a problem getting a vet, whether it was John Blake, Tom Hanley or the late Ed Corry. They were fine vets and great men. There is now a new group of women in the practices. We had never seen a female vet previously but there are quite a few now and they have brought a new dimension to it which is great.

I am always taken by the loss of students who have to go overseas. They come back fine vets. They go to Hungary. I meet them on flights to the Netherlands. Why have we not been able to grow this sooner? It galls me to see so many professionals having to go overseas to be trained. We can have courses for just about anything now. We are developing courses that are activation measures to keep some people busy but we will not focus on what we have and what we need. We are seeing people emigrate. We are losing them, and they might never come back.

This goes back to the point made by Deputy Farrell, and perhaps there is some validity to it. I had occasion to speak to a recently retired GP about the problems in medicine and the inability to get GPs. He told me that he would not make it as a GP now. He said he would not get into medicine. I will not name the man, but he is fine GP. Some people here know him. He is a superb GP and a fine medic, as well as a man of great personality. He said he would not get into the course now. There is a parallel with what is happening here. We are only getting the crème de la crèmeof academic brilliance at the upper end of the scale.

This is not to take from the point made by Mr. Moriarty. Some of us are not capable of being airline pilots. We can manage at a layer below that to do something else. Not everybody can be a vet. We are getting just the top students and by their nature they want to go into research. It is happening in medicine. They want to travel the world. They want to take it to the nth degree. They want to be the new pioneers on the frontiers of advancing medicine. They do not want to be a GP in Tulla or Kilfenora dealing with a scratch or a tear. It is not where they want to be. In the context of medicine and veterinary medicine, how will we find a model whereby we get the competency and do not move away from the standard but we get people who want to do this type of practice?

Is there a separate stream for large animals? There is not because there has to be a multidisciplinary approach. Should we attempt to plan for where the gaps are, knowing that we have to find a cohort? Perhaps it could be through a graduate programme for people who have studied agricultural science or people who are already in a practice of some description. I like the idea of advanced veterinary practitioners. It is happening in medicine. It is the only way we are surviving right now. It has happened in the United States. I do not know about the veterinary side but friends of mine in the United States would recognise the role of advanced nurse practitioners. They do not see GPs any more because the specialty is so great they are everybody wants to be a brain surgeon. I am being somewhat facetious in saying this but people understand what I am saying.

It is the old Einstein theory. If we keep doing the same thing and expecting it to be different next year, or that it is someone else's problem, this is the definition of madness according to Einstein. The witnesses have a great opportunity to do something different because they are starting with a clean sheet. It is difficult for the people in UCD. We are all a bit like this. I canvass in a particular way and I might not be successful on occasion. Somebody new coming to the table can choose to go a different route. The witnesses are in this position. I like what they are about and what they are trying to do. They have an opportunity not to fix it but to recognise where the system is not delivering for the needs of society. If they figure it out perhaps we can overlay it on medicine. This was more commentary than questions. If the witnesses have any responses, however, I would welcome them.