Mr. R?n?n Hession:

There are some exceptions. I know that most farmers, rather than going on to disability allowance, are covered by farm assist, which is basically a farm variation of jobseeker's allowance. Over the last couple of years, working with colleagues in the Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine, we have extended the list of schemes that are exempted from the means test there. We have tried to keep up with the times. The number of schemes has expanded. In the last budget we added to that list, and we expanded it in a previous budget. Generally speaking, when it comes to means-tested schemes, that is the intention. I am not 100% sure about disability allowance off the top of my head. I will come back to the Senator on that.

On the Senator's question about arts grants, we work quite closely with colleagues in the Department of Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media. I was on the task force dealing with basic income, and we engage with the Department a lot in dealing with Disabled Artists, Disabled Academics, DADA, the disabled artists and academics group that Emily Conway is involved with. Basically, the way it works is that if you are an artist, whether disabled or not, and you get a grant or some sort of bursary, normally that is for a piece of work. In other words, it is equivalent to employment income. What we normally do is we look at the period of work that is due to take place, and sometimes we have to consult with the individual to get better information, and the income spread over that period. It is not the case that you get a grant and suddenly your disability allowance is cut off. For example, if you got a grant of €2,000 which, spread over the period, was going to amount to €100 a week over 20 weeks, then that would be covered by the disregard. Because we call it employment income, it can benefit from the disregard. That is how it works, whether you are on disability allowance or other means-tested payments.

On the Senator's question about making disability allowance a universal payment, at the moment disability allowance is a €2 billion payment for 150,000 people. According to figures from the 2016 census, there are 640,000 people with disabilities. We do not yet have the new figures from the most recent census, but I am assuming that number will go up. In terms of the order of magnitude, it is a quadrupling of the number. If you were to pay everyone with a disability a disability allowance regardless of their means, then that is the cohort we are talking about. It is a very large number.

On invalidity pensions, I know that the scheme is terribly complex. Effectively, disability allowance is the main means-tested scheme. Invalidity pension is the one for people with contributions. Most disabilities are acquired. In other words, if a person is working and they acquire a disability, invalidity pension is probably the payment they will go on to. When they are coming off that, they will go on to a transition payment called partial capacity benefit. I know that some of the people who appeared before the committee last week are on that payment.

The payment is given depending on the level of disability, a certain portion of it is retained and there is no income cap. People can earn as much as they like without it affecting their payments. The payments are linked to the level of disability and resulting incapacity. That payment typically lasts for 156 weeks in social welfare language, or three years, although approximately half of the people have been receiving it for more than five years. It can be extended.

The reason disability allowance is a means tested payment is that we are taking a limited pot and trying to direct it at the people who have the lowest means. It is for people who do not have an insurance record from employment that would allow them to use another scheme. There is a live debate about universal basic income, not only in the area of disability but also for carers. The Low Pay Commission, the Economic and Social Research Institute, ESRI, and others have been working on it.