Eileen Flynn (Independent) | Oireachtas source

I will begin by saying the best learning can be summer programmes for inclusion and getting to know other students. A tutor said to me one time that the best learning you will ever do when you are on placement is the learning you have over a cup of tea. That was 100% right, so I would not say the summer programmes are not learning, because they are.

On the Irish language, it should be a choice for all refugees if they want to take it as a subject. They may not. People from other countries being left out of that is inequality. We have seen it happen to Travellers time and again. You do not do Irish because you are a Traveller and that can put you at a disadvantage. I wanted to highlight that. Before I forget, I would love a copy of the report Ms Ward mentioned, if that is possible. The Minister of State, Deputy Madigan, was here two weeks ago. We asked questions and I was told not many people from Ukraine in our schools have disabilities. I would love a copy of the report in order to be able to do some work around access for children with disabilities.

A few years ago, there was a quote that asked who are we to say that a child matters more or less because of the community that child is from. Unfortunately, that is exactly what the Irish State is doing. As a member of the Traveller community, I have seen how Travellers are treated as less and how that can really impact on your life and on the whole community. I welcome the Ukrainian refugees. It is important and very positive going forward.

I genuinely believe we should treat all refugees who enter the country with the same dignity and respect. I worked with the Migrant Rights Centre Ireland and did some voluntary work throughout my ten years of activism. I was also involved with the Irish Refugee Council. I think of the amount of lobbying and campaigning for simple things like the PPS numbers. I can understand how much anger is out there among the refugees. What we are doing is dividing to conquer, whereas what we should be doing as a society is bringing people together. I do not see that in sight for us yet, as a country. Going forward it is about the learning we can implement and what we can do in our country. While it looks like we are really supporting people from Ukraine - that is damn right, and we should be doing it - people are staying in one bedroom or in hotels. They have no access. Again, being a member of the Traveller community, I know how accommodation can have a dramatic impact on your education and your well-being. You are fleeing a war situation and then you end up in a small room and your freedom is genuinely gone. We see that with direct provision as well. We need to tackle accommodation for refugees here. I have not got the answer as to how we are going to do that. Of course, this was not planned, and we will do what we can in order for people to be safe. Nobody is saying otherwise, but earlier I wrote to the Leader of the Seanad to ask when the Minister for Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth, Deputy O'Gorman, will come to the House for a debate around ending direct provision because it is a year since the White Paper was launched. I am aware that a crisis has come upon us and how we deal with it I do not know; I do not have the answers to that. However, I would like to see us end direct provision for people who are fleeing war in Afghanistan and access to education for people fleeing all wars.

I have questions. I apologise to the Chairman; I will ask them very fast. On trauma and psychological supports, are those supports extended to all refugees? I have spoken many times in this committee and in the Seanad around the digital divide. Have we seen that happening with Ukrainian refugees? Are people getting equal access to digital devices? What kind of software needs to be downloaded for people so they can access education, be it in Ireland or Ukraine?

The most burning issue for me right now is ending direct provision and trying to get people out of hotels as fast as we can and get appropriate accommodation for people. How do we do that?

Turning to Mr. Henderson, it must be very tough for the Irish Refugee Council and the members it works with when they are seeing how one group of people is treated here and how another group is treated. How is the council dealing with that in terms of access as well? As Mr. Henderson said earlier, can we spread that out? Again, we welcome it and it is something I welcome with open arms but how do we spread it out for all people who are fleeing war zones?

I thank everyone so much for coming in. They do brilliant work with all refugees. I really need to credit them all for that.