Mr. Warren Graham:

Whether it is from rehabilitation or otherwise, prisoners mature and eventually will grow tired of jail, especially if they are there long enough. I do not know how we can interrupt the patterns or whether we should engage with people at the age of 22 or 25 to prevent them waiting until they are 35 before they retire from criminality or prison. Rehabilitation and resources are a key to that. As Ms McCaffrey said in the context of prisons, if a governor deems Mountjoy not to be equipped for rehabilitation but deems Wheatfield is, it is then about selecting whether prisoners who are, say, receiving rehabilitation should be kept in Mountjoy. I did all my time in Mountjoy and did very well out of it, but that was my personal choice and responsibility. It worked for me but it will not work for everyone, although it can work for others.

On life sentences, guidelines would be helpful in the sense of having something to aim for. It used to take five years but now takes 12 years before a prisoner will see the parole board. If there were engagement early on with life sentence prisoners from the Prison Service's psychology and probation services, the 12 years could be something to aim for where the prisoner has met certain standards and he or she can then progress over the course of the following years into open centres and eventual release, whenever that may take place. As for having a minimum length of time, I do not know where that would start or finish. There are some prisoners who have been inside for 30 or 40 years, and it can be hard when you wonder whether that is to be your fate or that of guys who started at the same time as you. It is difficult to digest the fact somebody may have been 35 or 40 years in the prison system and will probably never get out. In any event, there is the question of what type of world he will be getting out into and how he or she will survive. There are many issues relating to life sentences. We are in a state of uncertainty and we do not know what the future looks like, and we will have to wait it out and see how it goes. New prisoners, if there is early engagement, can really benefit from rehabilitative opportunities and resources to help them over the course of those first 12 years.