Dr. Joseph Ryan:

I wish to complement the points made by Mr. Miley. I thank Senator Malcolm Byrne for his questions, which really get to the heart of the matter. I agree with Mr. Miley that the Department provides policy. In our opening statement, we made the argument for a very strong independent HEA. The question of independence is the first piece.

On the balance between the regulatory and fostering role, I would be on the same page as Mr. Miley. Ireland is a small island and there is definitely a case for a very strong fostering role. That does not compromise the role of the HEA as a regulator.

The Senator asked about autonomy and accountability. If the governance is working right, we do not need to get into the sanction area. However, ultimately a sanction provision is required. That is the meat I talk about in this piece. I accept the Senator's point that governing bodies should follow the function. That is what I am getting at. We could actually make the governing bodies too small, as set out in this draft.