Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Thursday, 5 October 2017

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Foreign Affairs and Trade, and Defence

Defence Forces Strategy Statement 2017 to 2020: Department of Defence

9:00 am

Mr. Maurice Quinn:

No. Just to confirm, if I get the right treaty amendment - it has just slipped my mind. We have participated very actively in the Common Security and Defence Policy of the European Union from day 1. It all takes place within the context of the UN charter. It improves our capacity to participate in peacekeeping missions and adds to the security of the European neighbourhood, thereby impacting positively back into the security of the European Union. There is a range of structures around the Common Security and Defence Policy, including the External Action Service, the Military Committee and the military staff, but it is important to point out that when one looks at what the European Union is doing, it has what is called "the comprehensive approach". This is the whole range of capabilities the European Union can deploy from aid to diplomacy, finances and military and civil emergency capability. All of those are part of the capabilities available to the European Union to deploy. The military is one of those and we are aware of the missions the European Union has deployed on. We have participated proudly on all of those bar one and we work within the policy parameters set down by the Government to fulfil our obligations to the European Union in that regard.

That leads on to Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan's point around interaction with other militaries. We talk internally about being a partner of choice when we are participating in overseas missions. We will never deploy alone because we are not big enough. We will always deploy with others. It is very important that our colleagues in the Defence Forces can interact closely with those with whom they are deployed. Their safety depends on it as well as the efficacy of the mission. It comes down to very small things such as whether the wheel nuts on a truck can be used or a nozzle fitting and it goes right up to the use of ammunition, doctrine and communications.

When we are deployed with Estonians and Finns in southern Lebanon, we must be as close as we can possibly be to work with them. Partnership for Peace is a very important part of achieving that. Some of the work that is going on in the European Defence Agency is an important part of that also. It is very hard to separate our participation in peacekeeping missions from having the capacity to participate effectively in those by being interoperable with others and engaging with them. That is a key point of the business and the way we go forward in what we do.

There are no Irish Defence Forces personnel deployed in Afghanistan and Iraq. I might have to come back to the committee on the detail of the Western Sahara MINURSO mission. It is a long-standing UN mission and there are three Defence Forces members in Western Sahara at the moment. All of our missions are kept under review on an ongoing basis and I can get the committee more detail should members wish to have it. A ship is due to depart tomorrow to participate in Operation Sophia and it will hopefully be on station by the following Friday. It is a proud day for the Naval Service as this is its first time participating in a UN-mandated mission. We wish them well with that. The point about Operation Sophia is that there are stages to the mandate. As with all military participation in peacekeeping missions, nations put in caveats as to what they will and will not do, some of which is down to national policy. Because of the triple lock, we will not participate in any part of the mission which is not covered by the UN mandate. That is not unusual for us. In any event, the third part of Operation Sophia has not been activated. It is part of feet-on-the-ground in Libya. I can come back to the committee on the detail of that. We are participating on the high seas and it is all within the UN mandate set out for the mission.

I am bouncing around a bit but I turn to the purchase of equipment from Israel. Members will be aware that our task is to ensure we get the best kit for our colleagues within the Defence Forces. There is a principle which governs the way we do that, which applies to all of government, namely, the tendering process. We have to deal impartially with all of the companies which are entitled to enter into procurement competitions. We have to work on that basis. Barring Israeli companies from entering tendering competitions for the provision of military goods would be akin to Ireland unilaterally placing an embargo on such goods from Israel. This would be a foreign policy matter and outside the remit of the Department of Defence. We work according to Government procurement rules and the EU procurement rules. Israel is not precluded from tendering within Europe, not just in relation to defence equipment, but more widely.

Members will be well aware of the challenges we have in the Air Corps. We had a problem with pilots for some considerable period of time. They get fantastic training and they are really good people who are very attractive to outside employers. With the pension arrangements in place, we have had a bleed of pilots over a long period of time. On top of that, we had the air traffic controller situation as a result of other employers coming on the scene. Comprehensive work is in place to get the Air Corps back up to full capacity. Members will be aware that we made a very strong submission to the public service pay commission on pay for pilots and air traffic controllers. The commission's report recognises that there are specific issues in defence and refers to pilots. That is where we hope to address them quite soon. We will get behind the issue of how to retain our pilots.

We have four air traffic controllers in training currently with up to eight more in line for training. The aim is to get back up to full speed gradually, albeit I cannot provide an exact timeline for the committee. It is a function of the amount of work going on in the Air Corps, but we aim to be back on schedule with air traffic controllers in the Air Corps during 2018. I note that this afternoon five new pilots will be commissioned into the Air Corps. The challenge is that they are young pilots and they have to develop their experience while we are losing more experienced personnel. The challenge is to keep the experienced people. The Minister has told us to look at the potential for re-entry, whereby pilots, in particular, who have left may wish to return. We have been asked to find a way to take them back because of their skills and experience. The other avenue is direct entry whereby we might be able to take in people who became pilots by other means. We are looking at everything we can to keep and recruit pilots.

We are working very closely with the Department of Health on the restrictions on the Air Corps and their impact on inter-hospital transfer to ensure that patients can be got to the UK. There were two out-of-hours emergency transfers in the last couple of weeks, which the Air Corps managed to carry out. However, the challenge is that the Air Corps needs its experienced people to train up air traffic controllers and pilots. If we expect those people to be on-call from 8 p.m. to 8 a.m., they will not be available during the day for training. As such, we need a bit of space.

That is why it is a moveable target in terms of getting everybody up and running next year. We need a bit of space to get that done. We are working very closely with the Department of Health and HIQA on the means by which that service can be provided. It was always the intention that the Coast Guard would be a backup and that the private sector would be a backup. We were never a dedicated service for transfers; it was always on an as-available basis. That would mean we would have available an aircraft, a crew and air traffic controllers. That out-of-hours availability is certainly quite significantly reduced at the moment.

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