John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I wish to open this meeting as I did the earlier one with the Minister of State at the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Canney. In the earlier session, we dealt with an Estimate of roughly €370 million and in this session, we are dealing with an Estimate worth €392 million, which is a substantial amount of money. The Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform has spoken in glowing terms of the reform that is taking place in the wider Civil Service and yet we, as a select committee, are expected to operate under Standing Order 90. The committee is only empowered to consider the Estimates and cannot alter, amend or vote on them. The committee must send a message to the Dáil when it has completed its consideration of the Estimates and it cannot decide not to do this. Under Standing Order 90, the message must be to the effect that the select committee has completed its consideration of an Estimate referred to it by the Dáil. There is no provision for the expression of an opinion by the committee on the Estimates in its message. As the Standing Order prescribes the nature of the message to be sent, the content is not a matter for decision by the committee.

I read that note out in the last session and have done so again because reform of the Civil Service, etc., is part of the remit of the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform. This session is a farce. It is a box ticking exercise. There is a perception that we examine Estimates here and send a message of our own accord back to the Dáil but that does not happen. We do not have the time and we are due to finish today at 12 noon. That means we are confined by time and Standing Order 90. This is a box ticking exercise and we have no real input. This is a bit theatre in terms of examining the Estimates. This is an appalling way to do the business of the select committee. I know this is not the fault of the Minister and I know we are going through a period of discussing reform. If ever a system needed reform, it is this one. It is a farce and is not working. Members will get into the generalities of Estimates but we do not have the time to drill down into figures and analyse them. That is regrettable in what we describe as an era of new politics. It is just the same old, same old and something urgent needs to be done to rectify the situation.

As Deputy Cullinane said earlier, this matter is not about the officials. However, when officials appear here, their names do not appear on the screens. The officials have no objection to that. It would be helpful for the committee members to know the officials, their responsibilities and to name them as they speak.

We must be mature in our efforts to examine the Estimates in a restricted timeframe and process. It is like being placed in a political straitjacket and being told what to do. One can neither act nor speak and the same message will go back to the Dáil. That is my view of the matter. I hope the Minister, within the Cabinet, particularly given his experience on committees - the same goes for his Minister of State, Deputy Eoghan Murphy - we will see the type of change necessary to really deal with these Estimates. I have placed my views on record because I believe that to be the case.