Seanad debates

Wednesday, 20 March 2024

12:00 pm

Photo of Lisa ChambersLisa Chambers (Fianna Fail)
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The Order of Business is No. 1, Court Proceedings (Delays) Bill 2023 – Second Stage, to be taken at 2.45 p.m. and to conclude at 4.30 p.m., if not previously concluded, with the time allocated for the opening remarks of the Minister not to exceed ten minutes, those of group spokespersons not to exceed ten minutes, which may be shared, those of all other Senators not to exceed four minutes, and the Minister to be given not less than ten minutes to reply to the debate; No. 2, Research and Innovation Bill 2024 – Second Stage, to be taken at 4.30 p.m., with the time allocated for the opening contribution of the Minister not to exceed ten minutes, those of group spokespersons not to exceed ten minutes, which may be shared, those of all other Senators not to exceed five minutes, and the Minister to be given not less than ten minutes to reply to the debate.

Photo of Pat CaseyPat Casey (Fianna Fail)
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The issue I want to raise relates to the communications strategy of the Department of Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth, specifically regarding sites that have been identified as potential locations for the housing of people seeking international protection. Every one of us in this Chamber has been affected by its communications at this stage. The current policy on which the Department has agreed, namely, keeping everybody, including council officials and indeed gardaí, completely in the dark, is becoming unacceptable. The lack of information is leading to speculation, and that speculation is completely off the radar.

There is another problem. In raising it, I refer to a specific case in Wicklow. Last Friday week, I got a phone call at 5.30 p.m. or 6 p.m. from someone stating a site in Newtownmountkennedy had been identified as a potential location for people seeking international protection and that it was being assessed as a potential site.On Monday, we got written confirmation that the site was being assessed. Over the weekend, crews and machinery moved onto the site and by Tuesday, the topsoil was being taken off an acre of ground. On Wednesday, membrane was put down and on Thursday, hard core was put down. This has nothing to do with assessing a site. This is the preparation of a site for something. The road had to be closed so that a second access road into the site could be created.

The people of Newtownmountkennedy are frustrated and annoyed. From my point of view, we were told by the Department that the site was being assessed. In the public interest, we passed that information on to the community but that information was misleading, at best. The Department was not being truthful or honest with us, as public representatives, with the local communities, the local authorities and An Garda Síochána.

Whether we have the communication at the start or the end of the process, interaction with the community has to happen at some point. I believe it should happen at the start of the process because we are losing properties because of misinformation. A meeting was held yesterday morning, assisted by the Department, to which only one Oireachtas Member was invited, along with some members of the local community. No other Oireachtas Member was informed of that meeting. That cannot be allowed to happen. If we are to bring any credibility back to this process, we must put early and truthful communication with the people at the heart of it. We must tell the people exactly what is happening in their communities. Let us not hide behind spin and false, misleading information, which is what public representatives are receiving. We are putting that information into the public domain and then people have no respect for us because we are misleading them. The Department has to address this immediately.

Photo of Michael McDowellMichael McDowell (Independent)
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On the day that is in it, I will commence by expressing my own personal thanks to the Taoiseach, Deputy Leo Varadkar, for all of the work he has done for Ireland during his period as Minister, Tánaiste and Taoiseach. They have been stressful and hard years and I fully understand the toll that such service can take on people who have dedicated themselves to public elected office. I want to thank him for one thing in particular, for which I will never cease to be grateful. When Sergeant Maurice McCabe needed an ally in public life, it was the Taoiseach, Deputy Leo Varadkar, who stood up for him and showed amazing personal courage in doing so.

I also want to remind the House that recently, in the aftermath of the referendum result, he wrote an article in which he said he had also been on the losing side in the referendums on the abolition of the Seanad and on Oireachtas inquiries. He said he was disappointed at the time, amid recriminations, but came to realise that the people were wise and made the right decision. He said that the Seanad provides a check and a balance on the Dáil that would otherwise not exist and that we have seen the value of that in recent months. That was a generous statement from him to make because he was, until very recently, a convinced abolitionist.

This House has a limited role in relation to legislation. We can, under Article 23 of the Constitution, amend Government legislation or propose our own legislation but Dáil Éireann has the power to effectively reject our views after 90 days. That 90-day period is not very long. I mention that because I believe Ireland is developing and maturing into a different kind of democracy. The sad moment when Members of this House were forced to vote, by a party whip, for their own abolition should be a memory of the past only. I appeal to Members of this House, not today but over the coming weeks, to consider whether the application of a party whip in every matter really adds to Irish democracy or whether it would be far better for Members of this House, bearing in mind the limited role they have, to take it on themselves to express their own individual outlook and to vote in accordance with their own individual preference.It would be remiss of me if I did not wish the Taoiseach all the best. We were all taken aback, or even shocked, when he made his announcement at 12 o'clock. To me personally, to the Fine Gael Party and to the people of Ireland, he has been an exemplary Taoiseach and I wish him all the best. It was a decision not taken lightly and, judging by his words, it was both a personal and political decision, which I respect. Certainly, these have been very turbulent times, with the Government successfully overseeing Ireland through Covid and also the recovery of the economy, and the Taoiseach was there as part of the Government throughout those times. It is not an easy decision and I wish him, his family and his staff well. I thank him for everything he has done for the country. I have received many text messages from people throughout the country saying they are totally shocked and asking me to wish him all the best. It is nice that people are remembering him.

The other issue I raise relates to small businesses. They are on their last legs. I acknowledge the Minister, Deputy Coveney, will meet representatives of small businesses in Limerick over the coming days but those in retail and hospitality, in particular, need something done for them. They need changes to be made and perhaps the VAT rate to be reconsidered. It was increased from 9% to 13.5% and that needs to be looked at. Small businesses cannot compete at the same level as big businesses and we need to differentiate between the two and find a policy that works. One size does not fit all. We need to find something that will help save small businesses. I understand the Minister is due to come before the House for a debate at some point, but I would like that to be expedited because I know from having spoken to small businesses that some of them are on their last legs.

Photo of Rebecca MoynihanRebecca Moynihan (Labour)
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It would be remiss of me not to wish An Taoiseach, Leo Varadkar, all the best as he resigns and embarks on a new chapter in his life. It is always a big day in the Houses of the Oireachtas when a Taoiseach resigns, and we were all taken aback today by the resignation of Leo Varadkar. Even though he and I come from opposite ends of the political spectrum, he was always a politician of conviction from his side. I wish him and his Fine Gael colleagues the very best as they embark on the difficult internal process of choosing a new leader and, potentially, a new Tánaiste.

I raise the issue of the IPO applicants in Dublin who were moved on Saturday to Crooksling in the Dublin Mountains, a former nursing home that had been planned to be used for asylum seeker accommodation but was set on fire by far-right agitators a number of months ago. I think a lot of the men were very happy to be moving from Mount Street on Saturday because the conditions had become very unsanitary and there was a public health issue. There were no toilets or showers, there was waste in the street and there was no management of the public sphere there.

Unfortunately, however, the men were taken away and dumped at the border of Dublin and Wicklow in the Dublin Mountains and told they could pitch their tents there, while back in Dublin, people were cleaning up tents and taking away belongings from the men, some of whom had been taken surprise, and on which volunteers had spent thousands of euro in the preceding weeks. Some very good tents were destroyed and we do not know by whom. Some people have said it was done by people involved in the cleanup, while others said it was done by far-right agitators. One of the key questions that need to be answered concerns how protestors knew which site people were being taken to.By the time they arrived on Saturday there were anti-immigrant and far-right agitators outside ready to cause trouble in Crooksling. It put the men, the IPAS staff and the security staff in danger. There are real questions to be answered as to how they got word that is where people were going. We do not flag where asylum accommodation will be for that very reason and there are real questions as to how they knew and how they managed to arrive there so quickly. I ask the Leader to raise this matter with the Minister for integration and the Minister for Justice as to whether there is somebody within the Department who is letting that information slip out. It is very serious. Somebody at some stage will be hurt and killed if we do not take action on how people are finding out where very vulnerable applicants are being placed before they end up going there.

Photo of Gerry HorkanGerry Horkan (Fianna Fail)
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On the day that is in it, I wish An Taoiseach, Leo Varadkar, the very best. It is fair to say I am the only Fianna Fáil Senator in the Chamber who the Taoiseach put a number one beside my name in a recent by-election. I do not think anyone else got a number one from Leo and I am pretty sure I did, so I can go down in history for that at least. I thank him for his support on that occasion and equally wish him the very best. He has given a lot of service to the Houses and the people, as a member of Fingal County Council initially, way back in 2005, later on in the Dáil in many Departments, including health, transport and enterprise, and as Taoiseach and Tánaiste.

I know the Cathaoirleach has travelled twice to the US recently. I was there on my own steam in recent days. I attended a parade where I was guest of honour in West Orange, New Jersey. I was the guest of an order of the Friendly Sons of the Shillelagh, and I am wearing their tie today. We have Irish diaspora all over the world, with close linkages and generations further back, especially from the Leader's county. I know in the case of my own grandfather, who was the youngest of ten and who came to Dublin from Mayo, that eight of his siblings went to America.

We should acknowledge the work the Irish diaspora does on behalf of Ireland and of their own communities right around the world,l particularly in the US and Britain but also right across the world in Japan, New Zealand, Australia, Canada and South America. We should acknowledge the work done by them on behalf of Ireland Inc. but also on behalf of those who left Ireland, some of whom were very successful and others who were less successful. There are community groups looking after the Irish and looking out for the Irish and for Ireland. We should see if there is a mechanism as to how we can honour these people in all that they are doing. I know we do that by going abroad and the global greening and so on, but I do not think we should ever underestimate the power of the Irish brand. It does not happen by accident. It is all these clubs and organisations all over the world promoting Ireland in a positive way and I thank them for that.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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The suggestion the Senator made at the end was a very good one. Having been to the United States for St. Patrick's Day, his points were well made and I will let the Leader respond to them.

Photo of Emer CurrieEmer Currie (Fine Gael)
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They say a week is a long time in politics. What about a morning? There will be a lot of political reflections this morning about the news about our party leader and Taoiseach, Leo Varadkar, but I will add some personal reflections. He has been my friend for more than 30 years and I hope we will be friends for over 30 more. As teenagers the politics seeped out of our pores and we were both quite heavily opinionated from a very early age. It would be fair to say that I probably came from the centre-left when I was that age and he was centre-right. Over the years we have met in the middle. Sometimes I despair that young people might think the centre of politics cannot be radical and it cannot be challenging, whereas it can. My whole life I have been inspired by responsible radicals and I think our democracy needs brave people like that more than ever.

The proud legacy he leaves in Dublin West can be seen every day in our hospital, our university and our schools. I thank his family as well for all the support they have given the party in Dublin West: Miriam, Ashok, Sonia, Sophie, their husbands and Leo's nephews, whom he is so proud of.Of course he will continue to work in Dublin West and I look forward to working with him. He has done so much in terms of nurturing this machine of an economy that we have, guiding us through Covid, his work on Northern Ireland as a proud nationalist and champion of the Good Friday Agreement. I am just so very proud of my friend and so grateful to my colleague and his loyalty. Sometimes I think the persona we saw is not what I know and I just want to say how proud and grateful I am this morning.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I welcome our colleague and friend, former Senator, Teachta Dála and Minister of State, Ned O'Keeffe. Ned was appointed to the 16th Seanad by An Taoiseach, Charles Haughey and he has been a good friend to many of us across the political aisle in Leinster House. Ned, you are welcome back and it is good to see you looking so well. Beir bua.

Photo of Tom ClonanTom Clonan (Independent)
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I want to echo the comments made about the Taoiseach, Deputy Varadkar. I have to say that over the years when he was Minister for Health and as Taoiseach, I have clashed with him on many occasions and we have had many very robust exchanges and disagreements. Throughout that time, An Taoiseach has shown great personal kindness towards me and my family and, particularly, my son Eoghan. I think it speaks to the man and who he is. I watched him very closely during his press conference today. I wish him well and I wish our colleagues across the line in Fine Gael the best of luck in whatever happens next and in whoever succeeds him.

I would also like to say that in the last few weeks we have heard the voice of the Irish people. They have spoken, and spoken very definitively. To quote Lincoln, with public sentiment anything is possible. Without public sentiment nothing can be achieved. To that end, and speaking to the collegiality that has been shown in this House, I would echo Senator McDowell's comments. We have very limited powers in this House but it could be a House of innovation, of moral and ethical leadership and courage. I echo Senator McDowell's call that perhaps the Whip should not always be applied in this House when we feel the weight of the public good behind us. That is something we should probably think about going forward.

I cannot let this moment pass without mentioning what is happening in Gaza and the pictures that we are seeing - it is not famine, it is forced starvation. As an Irish people we understand what forced starvation is. It is a weapon of war. It is not a famine in the received sense. I again commend the Taoiseach and Tánaiste on their very clear statements on this. Israel is committing the most appalling war crimes and genocide. We must speak out.

Photo of Erin McGreehanErin McGreehan (Fianna Fail)
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I propose an amendment to the Order of Business: "That No. 11 be taken before No. 1." The reason for this is the introduction of my Bill, the Control of Dogs (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill 2024. I care for animal welfare. I believe that those who neglect animals or behave recklessly should be penalised. This Bill will strengthen the legislation in respect of the control of dogs. I have worked with them on this Bill which will really highlight and advocate for positive change in legislation regarding microchipping, licensing, introduction of dog control notices and a few other things. While we are talking about dog control and we have the group set up across Departments, it would be really good to use my Bill as a template to move forward on dog control.

I want to honour a good friend of mine, Kenneth McBride, who lost his battle with cancer on Friday night. He was chair of Glenmore Athletic Club, my athletics club and he will be so sadly missed. He was a fantastic sportsman. He fought his illness with such courage and dignity. We had a sad but wonderful send-off in the community in north Louth, in the Cooley Peninsula.Rest in peace Kenneth. He will be very sadly missed.

Photo of Aisling DolanAisling Dolan (Fine Gael)
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It is indeed a day of change, shock and surprise to so many of us here in Leinster House. I am a Taoiseach's nominee and a person who is new to public life. I say new but it is now four or five years; I am not so new anymore. The leadership of the Taoiseach, Leo Varadkar, has been something that has been inspirational. At close quarters, working together in a coalition on the programme for Government and with different parties, I have seen things getting done. That has been a mark of this Government and of the Taoiseach as part of it and leading it. We have seen his humanity and his empathy in the speech that was given today. We have seen what this means to the man who has given an awful lot in terms of sacrifice for public service. In public life, we need people of courage and conviction. We need people with that humanity and kindness. That is something that has marked me over the past number of years. It is a major shock because this is the person who nominated me and who brought me to this role in public life and to be able to represent my region. It is very important that he is acknowledged as someone who looked at the country as a whole and who acknowledged there needed to be representatives from all parts of the country both in the Dáil and the Seanad.

We are seeing now that the country is at its highest population. We are seeing the most people back at work. These again are all elements of Government policy over the past ten to 15 years that have been brought to bear. There has been a lot of groundwork in that. The investment in our hospital networks and beds that we are seeing in regional areas is absolutely crucial. When it comes to being able to deliver services, that is something we have been able to do thanks to a prosperous economy. One of the other items I mention is what the Taoiseach has done-----

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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Time is up.

Photo of Aisling DolanAisling Dolan (Fine Gael)
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-----to make this country a better place.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I thank the Senator. It was just that people are straying all over.

I welcome the new Polish ambassador, H.E. Arkady Rzegocki and Agnieszka Skolimowska from the Polish Embassy. They are very welcome. I congratulate the ambassador on his appointment and we wish him well. We look forward to continuing the extreme friendship we have with Poland and the members of the Polish community who make a valuable contribution in our country. We thank all the Polish community for that. We wish the ambassador well in his tenure.

I now call on Senator Keogan.

Photo of Sharon KeoganSharon Keogan (Independent)
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We return to the House after the public vehemently and resoundingly rejected the proposals of the family and the care referendums. Today should mark a turning point for this Government and become a day on which the Government finally listens to the real concerns, difficulties and everyday issues of the population. With a voter turnout of 44%, the Government is now forced to acknowledge it is not listening to the pertinent issues of the public. Ireland does not need symbolic change but real changes.

Over St. Patrick’s weekend, we witnessed the embodiment of this Administration’s commitment to symbolic virtue signalling. Mount Street and Dublin city centre looked fine. No one visiting would have any idea that this was a city that had just destroyed the only homes that people who have come to this country availing of the IPAS system had, and who were greeted with inhumane and unlivable conditions. For those who witnessed these refugees being moved to the Dublin mountains, it made for harrowing scenes but this is the way of our Government. It disposes of the inconvenient; once out of sight, out of mind. Immigration rates are at a staggering high and exceeded 100,000 last year. This country simply cannot cope with housing, health, welfare and infrastructural needs of the people already here let alone newcomers. Plans and action must happen now. I call on the Minister for integration to come to this House and have a real debate on providing information to all Members of this House, to the public and to communities long kept in the dark about the IPAS system, and on how it plans to fix its chronic failures.

The public have sent a message with the results of the recent referendums. They want their Government to handle crises and real social problems. They want the Government to, at long last, act on its mandate while this Government believes its goal is to score its success by appeasing ideological fantasies instead of the electorate. The women and mothers of Ireland have made their voices heard.Any Irish mother would be right to tell this Government to cop on.

I also want to commiserate with our Fine Gael colleagues-----

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I thank Senator Keogan. Tá an t-am caite.

Photo of Sharon KeoganSharon Keogan (Independent)
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-----on the announcement by An Taoiseach. Of all the people I expected to resign this morning, it was not him.

Photo of Robbie GallagherRobbie Gallagher (Fianna Fail)
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I second the amendment proposed by Senator McGreehan that No. 11 be taken before No. 1.

The Irish Cancer Society's national Daffodil Day takes place this Friday, 22 March. A total of 99% of the funds it raises every year is through voluntary contributions. I thank the Irish people for their continued generosity in that regard. Some of the statistics relating to cancer are quite frightening. Every three minutes, someone in this country is told that he or she has cancer. That equates to roughly 40,000 people per year. It is devastating news for individuals and their families to get. Thankfully, the good news is that 80% of those diagnosed with stage 1 cancer make a full recovery. It is important to say that. It is also important that people get themselves checked on a regular basis.

The work being done by the Irish Cancer Society is truly magnificent. Those involved are true heroes, as are those involved with other voluntary support groups like Crocus, which operates in my area of Monaghan and Cavan. The Irish Cancer Society provides many services, one of which is ten free night nurse sessions in an end-of-life programme. The people who do that work are true heroes. Likewise, are the people who volunteer to drive vehicles in order to help people who have been diagnosed with cancer and who need treatment. These people volunteer their time free of charge to drive people to and from clinics to get treatment and they too deserve great credit.

It is timely that we would have a debate on the Government's response to those people who have been diagnosed with cancer and their families. I feel that much more could be done because a great deal of extra expense is put upon those people without warning. I would be grateful if the Leader could organise that. This Friday, I ask that the Irish public would do as it always does on national Daffodil Day and give as generously as they possibly can.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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We all agree with Senator Gallagher that Daffodil Day is very important for the country. We should all support it and encourage people to support it. I pray that the weather is fine for those who will be out collecting and for the volunteers.

Photo of Micheál CarrigyMicheál Carrigy (Fine Gael)
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It would be remiss of me not to say something about the shock news of the resignation of the Taoiseach. He is someone I am extremely proud to have served under, both as Taoiseach and as leader of our party. He is also someone who has sacrificed much for public life and public service. He has served the country well and with distinction. That will be the legacy he will leave behind. I am very proud to have served as a Member of the Oireachtas and as a member of the party under his leadership.

We have heard in recent times that energy costs are coming down significantly. Perhaps when one is busy in public life, one might not keep enough of an eye on one's bills and charges. I want to point out something that needs to be addressed, in particular for some elderly people who are coming out of contracts. The company I happen to be with is Flogas. I came out of contract on a high rate taken out during the energy crisis and the company increased my costs by 50%, which brought it back up to more than 60 cent a unit at a time when the average cost is less than 30 cent a unit. It was 100% my fault for not keeping an eye on it, but I am now putting something in place. I do not think companies should be allowed to do that. There are many vulnerable people and families that might not be keeping a tight rein on something like that who are caught with significant costs, which I think are exorbitant. The companies have made massive profits over the past 12 to 18 months. I do not think they should be allowed to go further. There needs to be a cap on the increase put on people when they go out of contract.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I thank Senator Craughwell for swapping places with Senator Keogan.

Photo of Gerard CraughwellGerard Craughwell (Independent)
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I, too, add my voice to those who have spoken on the Taoiseach, Deputy Leo Varadkar's resignation today. I will leave the media to decide what kind of Taoiseach he was. For me, he was a sensitive and shy man who was nice to meet and have a word with. I wish him well wherever he goes from here.

We are all aware of the drugs somebody tried to land off the south-west coast of this country last weekend. I understand drug barons are now using submarines to export drugs to Europe. The back door of Europe is Ireland and where was our navy this weekend? It was in Dún Laoghaire having a little show for the public. The single ship we have at sea was moored in Dún Laoghaire for the public to walk around, while our south-west coast was vulnerable. A hugely important conversation is starting in Europe about the financing of defence. Why do I bring that up today? I do not believe there is anybody in this House who does not support Ukraine. However, within days of the war starting, the then Minister for Foreign Affairs, Deputy Coveney, declared that Ireland was not neutral in the case of the Ukrainian war. That was followed by the current Minister, Deputy Mícheál Martin, saying the same. Who gave them permission to say that? Did they bring their opinion into the Houses of the Oireachtas to debate the change in Government policy, or was it just a solo run? We talk all the time in this country about neutrality. We do not talk about Paddy neutrality. Paddy neutrality is where we declare we are neutral and depend on NATO to look after us. We see now what the disinvestment in defence and security in this country has caused. We are an open back door for thousands of tonnes of drugs to be imported into Europe. Let us cop ourselves on and get rid of Paddy neutrality and arm our Defence Forces properly.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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We need to get Paddy timekeeping back in the Seanad after the recess.

Photo of Martin ConwayMartin Conway (Fine Gael)
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Like many others I got up this morning not expecting the Taoiseach to announce his resignation. However, he did and I think it was a courageous thing to do. Many people leave politics because they are ordered out and the electorate does not support them. To realise that he has given his best and it is time to move on to do other things when he could have realistically remained as Taoiseach for another year is brave, and it is something we all need to admire and take some leadership from. His record since he entered Cabinet in 2011 is quite remarkable because it has been a turbulent 12 or 13 years. We were broke as a country when he went into Cabinet with the former Taoiseach, Enda Kenny, and others. Within three or four years sovereignty was restored. We then had Brexit, which took careful diplomatic engagement, negotiations and discussions. We had not even dealt with Brexit when the pandemic happened. I think the Taoiseach, Deputy Leo Varadkar's leadership in the pandemic and his state of the nation address on St. Patrick's Day will define his premiership because his determination at that stage was to save lives. In my view many thousands of lives were saved because of the leadership of that Government and of the Taoiseach, Deputy Leo Varadkar, and the co-operation of the Irish people. In more recent times we had the inflation crisis, which was navigated. We are now hopefully looking at that coming to an end, or at least easing off. At 45 years of age, he has had a remarkable career, and I wish him well because he has made it clear he will continue to represent Ireland in whatever capacity and to do his best for Ireland. I think that is all we can expect of anyone.

Photo of Rónán MullenRónán Mullen (Independent)
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Is lá stairiúil é seo agus guím gach rath ar an Taoiseach, Teachta Leo Varadkar, agus é fógartha anois aige go bhfuil sé chun éirí as oifig.I would like to be associated with all those wishing Leo Varadkar well on this very surprising day when he announced he is to retire as Taoiseach and as leader of Fine Gael. I think the history books will show that Mr. Varadkar has been a very talented man and has sought to serve his country to the best of his ability. His talents have been on display on many an occasion.

While I would disagree with him on a number of issues, I cannot ask but express today my appreciation to him as a citizen and as a Member of the Oireachtas for taking on the difficult task of going into politics, standing up for ideas he believes in and giving leadership to his party and to the country. I think particularly of the very difficult time of the pandemic and, again, not everybody was happy with Government decisions, but I think we can all acknowledge that was a very difficult time to be in leadership. I wish him well on this day.

It is not really the day to get into the reasons he has chosen to make his decision at this time. Obviously, however, I am aware of what my friend and colleague, Senator McDowell, said about the Seanad and its role. I think people will be reflecting on the role of the Seanad in the recent referendum and the contributions made by many Members of the Seanad to bring the issues that were involved to light. I take this opportunity before the Easter break to ask that we have a debate. I support everything Senator McDowell said about question of the Whip in the Seanad, but I ask for a debate on those referendum results. I raised issues about the role of NGOs and their funding and how they have operated. There are issues about the role of Government and how it manages the flow of information to the public. Therefore, I ask that we have a reflective retrospective debate on the referendums and their outcomes at the earliest opportunity.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I ask all Members on all sides of the Chamber to have a reflective look at the clocks in Leinster House in their contributions post Easter.

Before I ask the Leader to reply to the Order of Business, on a personal level as Cathaoirleach, I thank the Taoiseach for his courtesy to all of us as Members of Seanad Éireann. I join Senator McDowell in thanking him for his personal commitment to public service as a Minister and Teachta Dála and as Tánaiste and Taoiseach. As we said, he served in extraordinary times that included an economic recession, Brexit, a pandemic, a war, an energy crisis and the events in the Middle East. I thank him for his service, commitment and personal generosity to many of us in this House.

I also pay tribute to former Deputy Emmet Stagg, who passed away during our recess. He was a gentleman with whom I had the pleasure of serving, as have some colleagues in this House. One might disagree with him on some matters, but he was always courteous, collegial and most gracious. I offer my sympathies to his family today. Ar dheis Dé go raibh a anam dílis.

Photo of Lisa ChambersLisa Chambers (Fianna Fail)
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I thank Members who contributed today. I acknowledge former TD and Senator, Mr. Ned O'Keeffe, who has joined us in the Seanad Chamber today, and the newly appointed Polish ambassador, who is with us also. I concur with the remarks of the Cathaoirleach regarding the passing of Emmet Stagg.

Senator Mullen is right to say this is an historic day. Every Member this morning spoke about the news that was announced shortly after midday, that is, the resignation of An Taoiseach, Leo Varadkar, as president and leader of Fine Gael. Of course, in time, he will be stepping down as Taoiseach of the country once there is a process to follow.

I will add my own remarks to that. On behalf of the Fianna Fáil Party and the Seanad, I wish Leo Varadkar well. He has had a very long and distinguished career in politics. I have no doubt that whatever the next chapter brings, he will equally bring the same drive, enthusiasm, integrity and intelligence to whatever role he takes on. He has been through many ups and downs as a politician, as Cabinet Minister, Taoiseach of the country and leader of his own party. He has taken a fair degree of hammering and criticism during his time doing his job and, as he said himself today, there is a limit to what any one person can take. He has been there for a considerable time and always said that he will finish up early and not spend his entire working life in politics. I suppose he is staying true to that.

It was a shock this morning for everybody. It certainly did not seem that it was known by even the other party leaders.Most people have wished him well for the next chapter and thanked him for his service. That is really what is appropriate for today. I concur with the remarks of Senators in wishing him well.

Senator Casey raised the ongoing challenges for the Department of Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth in managing immigration. I take on board his point regarding the accuracy of information being provided to Members. It is difficult as the point of contact in a community, as the Senator has been, to get information to people locally if one is not being provided with what one considers to be correct information. That makes the job much more difficult. He is right that in the absence of accurate information, people will fill in those vacuums or gaps with what may be incorrect information. From what he said, it does not sound like an assessment of the site he referenced is happening. It sounds like the foundation of a building is being constructed. That type of situation locally is regrettable because it breeds mistrust in communities. When the situation is as challenging as it is and shows no signs of abating, we really have to bring communities with us and ensure, at the very least, that when the information is available, it is made known to the members of the community that will be impacted. That will be appreciated by those communities.

Senator McDowell spoke about the Taoiseach and also mentioned the party Whip. The Whip is not applied in all circumstances. There are votes of conscience in which we are given a free vote. However, the work of government would be difficult to move forward if the Whip were not used. It is about trying to strike the right balance. As we see, it poses great difficulties at times for Members of the Government parties when they are trying to do their duty as a party Member while also having their own views on a particular issue. The Whip is not applied in all circumstances but the Senator is right to point out, as have others, that the Seanad has proved its worth on many occasions during this term in respect of scrutiny of legislation. There has been very good debate in this House across all parties, for example, on the hate crime legislation. The Seanad also shone in the lead-up to the recent referendums. We certainly have proved that the people were right and wise in rejecting the referendum on abolishing the Seanad. This House has since proved itself to be an absolutely essential part of our democracy. The bicameral system and the checks and balances this House provides are very important. It was the wise choice not to vest more power in the hands of a smaller number of people.

Senator Maria Byrne spoke about the Taoiseach. She also raised again the plight of small businesses. We will have a debate in the Chamber with the Minister, Deputy Coveney, on 17 April in which we can tease out those issues. I am very aware that many small businesses are put to the pin of their collar, with many such businesses in town centres closing. I agree with the Senator that a one-size-fits-all approach is not working. There are many small businesses, particularly in retail, competing with online stores. It is not a level playing field. The VAT decision has caused huge issues for food businesses in particular as opposed to the accommodation side.

Senator Moynihan spoke about the Crooksling issue, if I may call it that, with the movement of international protection applicants away from the IPO building on Lower Mount Street to a different site. I listened to Claire Byrne's radio programme in the car on my way in this morning. She spoke to a woman on site who described the conditions there. All I can say is there does seem to be an improvement, with access at least to showers and toilet facilities and the provision of hot meals. I am not saying it is adequate. Clearly, we would like to do better. However, there seems to be a good bit of improvement in what had been appalling conditions on Lower Mount Street.

Senator Horkan let us know he is the only person in the Chamber to get a first preference vote from the Taoiseach in the recent Seanad by-election.

Photo of Michael McDowellMichael McDowell (Independent)
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Did the Taoiseach show Senator Horkan the paper?

Photo of Rónán MullenRónán Mullen (Independent)
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He did it Bertie-style.

Photo of Lisa ChambersLisa Chambers (Fianna Fail)
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Trust Senator Horkan to make a memorable contribution today. Good on him. He referred to the recent visits by Ministers and Members of both Houses to locations across the globe in the run-up to St. Patrick's Day. He spoke really positively about the work of our diaspora throughout the world in bringing the Irish message to people and keeping Ireland connected to different parts of the world. The visits across the globe by our Ministers and Oireachtas Members are really important. No other country in the world has the access we do at this time of year. We need to look after that access because it is really important for the country. I concur with the Senator's remarks in this regard.

Senator Currie spoke about the Taoiseach and the importance of the centre of politics. I absolutely agree with her remarks.

Senator Clonan referred to the Taoiseach. He stated that the voice of the Irish people had been heard in the recent referendums. I agree with that. He also raised the issue of Gaza and what we are seeing there. That is really important to keep on the agenda.What we are watching there is the forced starvation of an entire population, which is just appalling. We are watching on as war crimes are being committed and we seem to be helpless to do anything about it. We are looking to the US to step in. We are out of words at this stage as to what we say about the appalling situation on the ground in Gaza and what has been done to people there. I want to thank the Senator for keeping that on the agenda today, despite the other news that has come up today.

Senator McGreehan has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business: "That No. 11 be taken before No. 1." I am happy to accept the amendment to the Order of Business. I commend the Senator on her work on animal welfare, animal protection and the control of dogs. We look forward to the debate on that Bill at the earliest opportunity.

I also want to extend my sympathies, as Leader, to the family of Kenneth McBride and Glenmore Athletic Club. Kenneth died recently of cancer. I did not know the man, but Senator McGreehan spoke very highly of him. I can only imagine how difficult it has been for his athletic community and his family and friends. May he rest in peace. I extend our sympathies to his family and community on his very sad passing.

Senator Dolan spoke about the Taoiseach. Senator Keogan spoke about the referendum and the need for the Government to listen to the real concerns and everyday issues being raised by people. She also spoke about the refugees being moved from Mount Street. It is a situation that nobody wants to see happening. We are finding it very difficult to meet the accommodation needs of those coming into the country. The Government is doing its very best to try to provide accommodation for people. It is my understanding that the location people were moved to is much safer and I think the people who have been moved are saying that as well. There are better facilities, but nobody is saying that is adequate. Obviously, we want to do better, but there was an attempt to try to improve the situation there. I take on board the comments that have been made.

Senator Gallagher has drawn our attention to the annual Daffodil Day, which will take place this Friday, and the important work being done by the Irish Cancer Society. It is doing amazing work and cancer survival rates are improving all the time. Research is so important, and it is really important that we support that fundraising effort on Friday and over the course of the weekend. He has asked for a debate on the Government's response to assisting people with the expenses that come with dealing with a cancer diagnosis, of which there are many.

Senator Carrigy spoke about the Taoiseach and the day that is in it. Senator Craughwell spoke about the issues related to the Defence Forces, the financing of the Defence Forces and the conversations that are happening at an EU level. The Senator will be aware that there is obviously a commitment under this Government to increase spending in the area of defence and much work has been done to identify where we need to get to. There is an acceptance on behalf of the Government that spending on the area of defence is too low and we need to increase that. We are going to level two of the three levels that were proposed. I take on board the Senator’s comments on the vulnerability of our coastline to deal with drug importation. That is a serious concern for the Government and one that is not being taken lightly.

Senator Conway spoke about the Taoiseach. Finally, Senator Mullen spoke about the contribution of the Seanad to the recent referendum debate. He asked for a debate on that issue, and on the funding of NGOs and issues that may arise from that. It is of course open to the Senator and his group to propose a motion relating to that during Private Member's time, but we will seek a debate on that as well if we can.

Photo of Jerry ButtimerJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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Senator Erin McGreehan has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business: "That No. 11 be taken before No. 1." Is that agreed? Agreed.

Order of Business, as amended, agreed to.