Mark Daly (Fianna Fail)
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The proposer of the Bill is Senator Vincent P. Martin and it is seconded by Senator Róisín Garvey. The allocated time is 16 minutes. They will share time. Is that agreed? Agreed.

Vincent P Martin (Green Party)
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I move: "That the Bill be now read a Second Time."

Cuirim fáilte roimh an Aire Stáit. I thank all of the Senators who co-sponsored this legislative initiative, along with my own Green Party grouping and Senator Garvey, the Green Party leader, for ensuring this Bill received the priority listing I believe it deserves and merits in our rare Private Members' business slot.

I know the Members have read the legislation and it is great to have the Minister in the Chamber to respond to it. It is a short piece of legislation, but it is an important piece. I will get some of the technical stuff out of the way at the outset. It includes the background. Section 14(c) of the Criminal Evidence Act 1992 is inserted in the Criminal Law (Sexual Offences) Act 2017. I believe the genesis comes from this. It provides that in a criminal trial an accused person shall not cross-examine in person any witness who is under the age of 18 in respect of certain serious sexual offences. The said 2017 Act also provides that the court may preclude an accused person from personally cross-examining a complainant victim who has attained the age of 18 years in such cases. The court may prohibit such cross-examination unless it is of the opinion that the interests of justice require the accused to conduct a cross-examination in person. Where the accused is prohibited from conducting that cross-examination in person, the court must allow the accused an opportunity to secure legal representation.

We submit that it strikes an important balance to not contravene the Constitution, to guarantee a fair trial with everyone equal before the courts and with a presumption of innocence. If, for whatever reason, no such representation is obtained, the court may, if it considers it in the interests of justice to do so, select an appointed legal representative to conduct the cross-examination. When an accused person is prevented from conducting the cross-examination of a witness in person, the Legal Aid Board shall grant a legal aid certificate to the accused person for the purposes of being represented.

The purpose of the Bill before the House is to extend and provide a very similar statutory provision and protection to apply to criminal court trial hearings dealing with the offence of coercive control. The new offence of coercive control was enacted on the Statute Book a year after that very significant legislative amendment in 2017, to which I have referred. This is done by a simple amendment to the Domestic Violence Act 2018, which included the new offence of coercive control under section 39, by simply putting in a further provision and qualification that would replicate the protection that a witness or a victim enjoys, or is afforded in respect of certain serious sexual offences. When the first Bill for serious sexual offences, which I believe was groundbreaking, came before the Seanad on 1 March 2017, the then Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Frances Fitzgerald, said, "Tackling domestic violence has been a priority for me throughout my career, going back to my days as a social worker in inner city Dublin and London".

What was true then is true now. Domestic violence is a pernicious evil that has devastating physical, emotional and financial consequences for victims as well as society as a whole. It is not acceptable that anyone in Ireland is subjected to abuse, fear and intimidation. In respect of coercive control, the person deemed relevant under the Act is someone who either past or present is the civil partner, spouse, boyfriend or girlfriend of the person being accused of inflicting coercive control.

It is also interesting, as I found in my research, that many years ago the campaigner Caitriona Gleeson said that by minimising the tactics used in coercive control relationships, current laws in Ireland also miss many of the most devastating effects. Coercive control needs to be treated as a serious criminal offence, at a similar threshold to repeated false imprisonment or hostage keeping. For many women in Ireland, this domestic terrorism, the persistent deprivation of liberty and safety continues to demonstrate a lacuna in the law for these destructive and life changing crimes. I agree with that, but this is a step in the right direction. It improves the position of those who find themselves on the receiving end of such abuse.

I will now turn to a current Senator, Alice-Mary Higgins, and I believe the Seanad deserves great credit for getting the offence of coercive control on the Statute Book.Senator Higgins said when she was campaigning for this during a Committee Stage debate on 4 July 2017 that her proposal and support for amendment No. 52, as it was, establishes very clearly an offence of controlling and coercive behaviour. The arguments we have heard against the introduction of this very necessary offence have been inadequate.

Senators have talked about the complexity but all law comes with complexities. I am delighted to say that as a result of a proud day for the Seanad, the offence of coercive control was included in the Statute Book.

I will refer briefly next to the offence we are talking about before we talk about the protection we will afford victims. The offence is to be found in section 39 of that legislation the Seanad was so instrumental in getting over the line back in 2018, and the legislation before us is an amendment to that legislation.

The offence of coercive control, which many Members may be aware of, is where:

(1) A person commits an offence where he or she knowingly and persistently engages in behaviour that—

(a) is controlling or coercive,

(b) has a serious effect on a relevant person, [which I will define shortly] and

(c) a reasonable person would consider likely to have a serious effect on a relevant person.

The legislation states:

(2) For the purposes of subsection (1), a person’s behaviour has a serious effect on a relevant person if the behaviour causes the relevant person—

(a) to fear that violence will be used against him or her, or

(b) serious alarm or distress that has a substantial adverse impact on his or her usual day-to-day activities.

(3) A person who commits an offence...

The legislation then continues to detail how the offence is punishable together with the sentencing parameters, which I believe, on a separate point, should be looked at again, and revised upwardly. Perhaps that is for another day but it is something that the Green Party is very aware of.

The legislation then continues to define a “relevant person”, as applicable under this provision, as a "spouse or civil partner of that other person, or ... is not the spouse or civil partner of that other person and is not related to that other person within a prohibited degree of relationship but is or was in an intimate relationship with that other person."

Section 40 of the originating Act is very interesting in that it discusses how there is an aggravating dimension to coercive control. It basically states, in section 40(1) of the legislation, that:

Where a court is determining the sentence to be imposed on a person for a relevant offence, the fact that the offence was committed by the person against a relevant person shall be treated, for the purpose of determining the sentence, as an aggravating factor.

In coercive control, due to the very nature of the definition I have outlined to the House, the fact of an intimate relationship being past or present is an aggravating circumstance. If we bring that into a trial where the person who may theoretically do the cross examination has knowledge of the triggering points, or of too much information about the person they are cross-examining, this may be utterly counter-productive.

There is also the possibility that a cross-examination could be adjourned and resumed overnight. We could have a situation where the person conducting the cross-examination and the person being cross-examined might be living in the same house. This provision would stamp that out and eradicate it but it strikes the balance, where all children under the age of 18 will not face this, but for persons over the age of 18, as emerged from the 2018 legislation, this may not happen.

One needs to be very careful to strike the balance. We must be ultra-careful in this field of law because we are dealing with people and the last thing that one wants to happen for legislation in this sphere is for it ever to be thrown out and found repugnant to the Constitution, or to have it reversed in the courts. That would be a retrograde step.

The originating provision, which my statutory provision amendment very much reflects, was very carefully considered by the Legislature of the day and will hopefully withstand any constitutional challenge.

I also want to thank Senator Norris, the father of the House, who was one of my early co-sponsors of this, and others who did not have the opportunity to sign the Bill.Senator Norris, however, was on the record a long time ago talking about domestic violence. He quoted and referred to President Putin in this House in 2017 with reference to legislation which was enacted in Russia, whereby the definition of domestic violence in Russia is that there has to be proof of a broken bone. We have come a long way with regard to how we treat domestic violence in the different ways we do that.

I have just realised that I must share time with Senator Garvey, which is a pleasure to do. I will conclude by saying that the danger of domestic violence in Ireland is stark. According to Women’s Aid one in four persons in Ireland has been subjected to domestic violence and abuse. It is essential that we have a more victim-centred approach to such criminal prosecutions. Affording an injured party more consideration and protection in coercive control prosecution cases is needed. Curtailing or restricting the right of an accused to cross-examine personally the victim will be a very positive protective step. I will hand over to the Green Party Seanad group leader, Senator Garvey.

Róisín Garvey (Green Party)
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Gabhaim buíochas leis an Leas-Chathaoirleach. I thank the Minister of State for coming to the Chamber and a big thanks to my colleague, Senator Vincent P. Martin. We have always remarked that we will not solve the issue around domestic violence and abuse towards women that is rampant in Ireland unless we also work with the good men of Ireland. Together, we can solve these very significant issues we face as women in Ireland.

Senator Martin is a perfect example of that, in that he dug deep and found a loophole and gap and he has now fixed that. Through the support of the Minister, this will no longer be an issue. He has introduced the Domestic Violence (Amendment) Bill to resolve an important issue in trials relating to coercive control. In some ways this is insane, but where one has a patriarchal society and a court system which is based on patriarchy, it is not surprising that there is such a thing as the perpetrator, which is normally the male, being allowed to cross-examine the victim. This is completely shocking. The fact that this amendment will reverse that is of great importance and shows that we are slowly moving into the 21st century.

People have the right to represent themselves instead of having a lawyer. People might choose to do that, particularly in cases of coercive control, as they feel that they may be able to intimidate the victim.

The whole definition of coercive control is a persistent pattern of controlling, coercive and threatening behaviour. It can include all or some forms of domestic abuse such as emotional, financial, physical and sexual, and can be from a current partner or an ex-partner, such as stalking, threats, isolation, intimidation, coercion and control, as well as physical or sexual violence. Unfortunately, too many people in Ireland are dealing and living with that situation, both male and female. It is predominantly female victims but there are also male victims.

A great deal more needs to be done and this is a very important step forward. There is also the definition of coercive control because it does not always have to be a partner or ex-partner. It could be a sibling or relation. We see many older people being intimidated and coming under coercive control.

A survey by Safeguarding Ireland found that one in five adults in Ireland was either currently experiencing or has in the past experienced financial abuse which can include pressure in connection with wills, property, inheritance or financial transactions, and the misuse or misappropriation of property, possessions or benefits.

The equivalent law in England and Wales, the Serious Crime Act 2015, extends the definition of coercive control to someone who is personally connected, which would include family members with whom the victim resides. I ask the Minister of State to consider being open to engaging with Safeguarding Ireland to broaden the definition of "relevant person" in the Act. This could be something to think about.

There is also a call from Women's Aid to highlight the need for greater legal aid. Sometimes if there is financial coercion, then that person has no money to defend himself or herself. We may need to extend the changes to legal aid to enable everybody to access it.The domestic violence agency needs to be set up as soon as possible. That was a big request of the Dublin Rape Crisis Centre's Noeline Blackwell and many other women's groups. I have worked with Clare Women's Network and Clare Haven Services in Ennis and have done fundraising and have supported them for many years. They deal with victims of domestic violence and coercive control. They are also now doing huge work around preventative measures and training social workers, doctors and members of the Garda to help them be aware of the signs of coercive control. It is a positive step in the right direction. I thank the Government and Cabinet for supporting the Bill. We have still a long way to go.

Robbie Gallagher (Fianna Fail)
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I welcome the Minister of State. On behalf of the Fianna Fáil group, I welcome this legislation. I commend my friend and colleague, Senator Martin, on bringing forward this worthwhile Bill. The Bill, as Senator Martin outlined, seeks to amend the Domestic Violence Act 2018 to protect victims of coercive control. We look forward to the Minister of State bringing forward further legislative changes to protect a broader group of victims of gender-based violence as they move through the legal system. The unlawful killings of women in Ireland over recent months and years are not just brutal acts of violence that shocked the nation, they also highlighted the fear that exists among women in our society for their personal safety. These brutal deaths enabled women to talk about their fear. More importantly, the deaths of women through acts of violence forced society to listen to that fear. We now need society and the political system to address this fear urgently and comprehensively and to take a good, hard and honest look at how the system responds to and meets the needs of women. The problem extends beyond the harrowing statistics of unlawful killings. Violence against women happens in many forms and the scale, unfortunately, is extensive. Most assaults on women go unreported. Many women are harassed as they go about their daily lives, with most harassment going unchallenged. More live under intimidatory control hidden behind doors, often in silence. Unfortunately, some men in this country believe that women should be controlled by and submissive to them and that violence and coercive control are acceptable ways of achieving those aims. Changing this requires a dramatic change in the views those men have of women and in the way they see acceptable behaviour. We in Fianna Fáil are working with others and external stakeholders on how we can bring about change from all angles and how we can change the culture of misogyny and respect, what improvements are needed across the legal system to support victims and their families and ensure access to justice and what unexplored avenues can better support women in the workplace, community and online.

I am delighted that the Minister of State is not opposed to this Bill on principle and consider that the intention behind the Bill has merit. The aim of this Bill is in line with Government policy, in particular with commitments to protect victims of domestic violence and as set out in the third national strategy on domestic, sexual and gender-based violence. It also complements the approach of the O'Malley review of protection for vulnerable witnesses in the investigation and prosecution of sexual offences. To implement the recommendations of the O'Malley review, work is under way to bring forward legislation to provide for protection against cross-examination by an accused for vulnerable victims of specified offences, including but not limited to coercive control, as proposed by Senator Martin in this Private Member's Bill

We need a zero-tolerance approach to violence against women. This will require all of us as a society to commit to that change. The Government has put forward a zero-tolerance strategy that would tackle domestic, sexual and gender-based violence through prevention, protection, prosecution and policy co-ordination. This is an essential step in co-ordinating a response to gender-based violence in Ireland. Quite simply, enough is enough when it comes to domestic violence against women. One of the pillars mentioned is protection. I stress that counties Monaghan and Cavan are two of nine counties that do not have refuge centres for people suffering from domestic abuse. That is an issue I would like to see addressed as a matter of urgency. I compliment Monaghan County Council and Nial O'Connor, the housing officer, who has been proactive in this particular area.I want to give a special mention to Tearmann Domestic Violence Services, under the stewardship of Siobhán McKenna. In many cases, they are the people who are the first point of contact when a woman is brave enough to come forward to tell her story. I am well aware of the excellent work that they have done, continue to do and no doubt will continue to do going forward. I would like to commend them as well. On the last day we were in the Chamber having a debate, mention was made of reports being made to the Garda that were not followed up on. That is very concerning. I would like to send out a strong message today that nobody should suffer in silence. I would encourage anybody who is going through that horror to come forward and report the matter to the Garda. I feel confident that their concerns would be addressed. If that was not the case, it is something I would be very worried about. We talk about refuge centres and the need for same. Perhaps we need to have a conversation and ask why it is that the woman is always the first person to leave the family home. Perhaps that is something we should look at as well. I commend my colleague, Senator Martin, on bringing forward this legislation, and I look forward to it becoming law.

Barry Ward (Fine Gael)
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Cuirim fáilte roimh an Aire Stáit agus roimh an mBille. Ábhar an-tábhachtach ar fad atá i gceist anseo. I welcome the Bill on behalf of the Fine Gael group. I congratulate Senator Martin and his colleagues for bringing forward this Private Members' Bill. It is an issue we have discussed in this House on a number of occasions. I need hardly go into the detail of how destructive, damaging and insidious domestic violence is, and the effect that it has not just on the direct victim, but on the family, the wider family and the household. It causes enormous damage to all of us in this country when it is allowed to occur with impunity. I was watching a debate in the plenary session of the European Parliament yesterday and my colleague the Dublin MEP, Ms Frances Fitzgerald, raised this issue and talked about the damage that gender-based violence causes. An interesting take she had on it was the effect it also has on our economy. She has identified that Europe-wide, domestic violence costs €366 billion per annum. She made the legitimate point that if this were happening in any other sphere, we would be jumping up and down about it. We have a lot of work to do. I know that at the European Parliament level there is a move to criminalise gender-based and domestic violence and I welcome that. We have made strides in these Houses. The Minister of State and his colleague, the Minister, Deputy McEntee, have been particularly forthright in bringing forward legislation that addresses gaps that people have seen in the criminal law in particular, as it applies to situations involving gender-based violence. This Bill is another step down that road, and I think it is an important step.

To be clear, one of the proposers talked about the courts system being based on the patriarchy. I do not quite understand that argument. I would say the courts system is based on a system of fundamental rights. Unfortunately, or fortunately, one of those rights is to allow people to defend themselves. Of course, they have that right and that it is as it should be. I say that as a criminal barrister with an interest in the situation. Nobody disputes the fact that individuals have the right to defend themselves. It does not mean that it is always appropriate. More often than not, I would suggest it is not the best thing for the person involved but that is a choice he or she is entitled to make. At the same time, in terms of that system of rights, there is also a hierarchy of rights, and no right is absolute. It is entirely appropriate, on occasion, to fetter one right in order to benefit the wider community or society. This Bill does that. It fetters the right to represent oneself, but it does so in the context where the balancing rights between one individual's right to represent himself - more often than not in cases like this - or herself and the right of a complainant to be able to bring a case to court, to make a complaint, to have it investigated and litigated before the courts in a criminal setting without the fear of having to face down in person the person whom - in most cases - she or he has accused of fairly heinous crimes. The coercive control offence, although relatively new to our Statute Book, has been there for an awful long time. It is only recently that we have recognised it properly in the law and recognised the damage it does. It is a particular type of offence that involves an alleged control by one person over another. The notion that in a criminal prosecution for that offence you could turn round as a complainant and have to sit there in court as the very person you have accused of trying to control you gets to hold sway in a courtroom and put difficult questions to you is anathema to the whole idea of having coercive control as an offence.

What is being done in this Bill makes perfect sense to me. I do not agree with Senator Ó Donnghaile on what he said in respect of removing that judicial discretion to decide whether it is in the interests of justice. I agree with him in that I find it difficult to envisage a situation where the court would make a decision that it must be in the interests of justice for an individual to cross-examine the person who has accused him, but I have always advocated for judicial discretion in this House. We must trust our judges, who are highly-qualified, competent and empathetic people. We must trust them to make the decision. I think one of the reasons that the proposers have left this in the Bill is to allow the least infraction on the constitutional rights on individuals and therefore the greatest possibility of the Bill passing. In section 1 of the proposed inserted section 39A, subsections (1) and (2) provide for the different scenarios where the person is under 18 or over 18. I say this again as somebody who is a member of the Bar, but it is important to recognise that we have, in this country, a group of highly-qualified advocates whose job it is to go into court and advocate for a particular side in a case. One of the advantages of having such a coterie of people is that in exactly this situation, they understand where the line is. They have an obligation, under the Bar Council code of conduct, to ensure they do not do things that cross that line and that they do not put things to witnesses to cause offence or hurt, which is not to say that that will never happen. There are times when it is appropriate and in order for that to be done, and sometimes it has to be done. There is a wild difference between an accused person getting up and, let us be honest, sometimes settling a score, and a professional barrister or advocate standing in to make that point in a professional controlled way.

If I may make some drafting points in the few seconds that I have left, in relation to subsection (3) of the inserted section 39A, guidance on what the time period should be would be helpful. I wonder about subsection (7) and the reference to civil legal aid as opposed to criminal legal aid, but I do support the elements of the Bill. I think it is a positive proposal that will put in place important protection for persons who come before the court complaining of coercive control or witnesses in that case, it makes sense for this buffer to be placed between them and the person against whom they have made that complaint.

Tom Clonan (Independent)
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I commend this amendment Bill. In my experience of dealing with gender-based violence over the last 23 years, I have learned that one of the significant features of it is the chilling effect the offence has on its reporting. Further to that, it is also my experience that prior to the advent of the terms "cancellation" and "cancel culture", in many cases where a person reports domestic or gender-based violence of any nature, they immediately are confronted with hostile scrutiny, isolation and cancellation. The word "patriarchy" was mentioned earlier. The amount of energy that is invested in cancellation, the isolation and hostile scrutiny of the people who are targeted in this way has always been a matter of interest to me. If even a tiny percentage of that energy was invested in trying to seek out the perpetrator and hold them to account, it would be a far more effective way of dealing with what is a persistent and profound problem in Irish society. I am delighted to lend my support to this Bill.

I agree with Senator Ward that we have an adversarial court system and we have advocates who seek to vindicate the rights of both the defendant and the plaintiff. This, however, is very carefully worded and constructed in such a way that even though a right might be to some extent fettered by denying individuals the right to cross-examine the person who is accusing them of coercive control and domestic violence, there are still significant protections contained within the Bill in the subsections to ensure that their legal rights and their human rights are fully vindicated.I support the Bill and thank Senator Martin for bringing it forward. I am a person who has been involved in investigating, raising, standing up and speaking out against gender-based violence and gender-based discrimination and have witnessed and experienced much reprisal and cancellation as a consequence. Anything we can do to combat that dynamic in Irish society is to be welcomed. I welcome the Domestic Violence (Amendment) Bill 2023. I commend it and I hope it will receive Government support.

Annie Hoey (Labour)
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I thank Senator Martin for bringing the Bill forward. We in the Labour Party are proud to be signatories of this important legislation. I also thank the Senator for organising an excellent briefing earlier in the audio-visual, AV, room, which covered both the legal perspective and the lived, practical perspective and demonstrated the impact this legislation could have.

I do not need to go through all the statistics but it might be useful to put some of them on record. In Ireland, one in four women who has been in a relationship has experienced domestic abuse by a past or current partner. That is a high figure. When I think of the multitudes of friends and families we all have, one in four is a worrying figure. Due to Covid-19 we saw a massive rise in domestic abuse with a 38% increase in calls to the 24-hour national freephone helpline in 2020 compared to 2019. In 2021, we saw 33,831 disclosures of abuse and 26,906 contacts with Women's Aid. Those are very big numbers and we know they are unfortunately only the tip of the iceberg. We are not capturing all the people who experience this. According to Women's Aid, 43 women aged between 18 and 25 have been murdered in our State since 1996. Of the resolved cases, 52% of victims were murdered at the hands of a current or former partner. Altogether since 1996, 249 women have been violently murdered, of whom 55% were killed by a current or former partner and 63% of the murders occurred in the women's homes. We know women are much more likely to experience domestic violence at the hands of a partner or an ex-partner, making domestic abuse and its rise since the pandemic, an urgent matter we must act on. Research by Midwifery Mattersshows that pregnant women are 60% more likely to experience physical domestic violence. What a stunningly alarming figure that is. It is alarming that midwives know about that and have to be on the lookout for it. These statistics are astonishing. They are only a few among many that could be talked about in detail.

As we know, domestic violence can happen to anyone regardless of gender or background, but we also know that women are at the centre of 90% of domestic abuse cases. In many domestic abuse cases, norms escalate into further power dynamics which lead to emotional, coercive and physical abuse. All of these are addressed in this Bill which considers how they can be tackled or dealt with in a way that will protect victims in a court setting. The level to which we continue to see cases of domestic and sexual abuse, domestic violence and coercive control shows why this Bill is so important. We must protect women and children and provide as much help as possible in order to get where we want to go as a State, namely to attain gender parity and other things. I will not go overly into the technical elements, but it was noted at the briefing earlier, that the language "shall" was being used to protect children. The word "may" is used further on in the legislation and in relation to children the language is "shall" in order to protect children and to take away the terror they may experience in the court setting. That is important. I welcome the use of the word "shall". It was also noted at the briefing, that we need awareness training and understanding of trauma, sexual and domestic violence and the impact these testimonies in our adversarial court system have on survivors of these horrors. Implementation of this Bill will reduce the retraumatisation of victims who seek justice against their abusers. We must have some kind of protection for victims of domestic violence to ensure the trauma they have endured is not caused to resurface when they seek help from the justice system. I welcome this Bill and we are proud to support it.

Mark Wall (Labour)
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I acknowledge Senator Martin for bringing this Bill forward. As has been said by my colleague, the excellent briefing we received today was most worthwhile. The speakers were knowledgeable. As always we had the excellent Noeleen Blackwell, CEO of the Dublin Rape Crisis Centre and Ms Jane McGowan, barrister-at-law, who outlined in great detail what was involved in this Bill.

As a public representative, like many in this room, I hold clinics in my constituency. When someone sits in front of me - I said this recently in this House - who is subject to domestic violence and coercive control, the fear and reality is brought home to me. One of the issues I discussed with Ms Blackwell today was the idea of trying to encourage more people to come forward through the legal system. That is what Senator Martin in doing in introducing this Bill. We want to encourage those who are victims to come forward and use the legal system. This Bill, as was said by Ms Blackwell today, is a step in the right direction. We must acknowledge that is what Senator Martin set about when he started to look into this Bill.

I also acknowledge the great work that is done by refuges, especially Teach Tearmann in my county, County Kildare. I know the Minister of State and his Department have supported them in the past, but I put out the call again today that we cannot give them enough support. We cannot give them enough funding for the work they do. I know it is something the Minister of State has always acknowledged. I am sure he will look at it again and look at where there is no refuge at the moment. When I deal with this matter, the first question victims ask is what will happen to them and where they can go. Unfortunately, despite the great work Teach Tearmann does, sometimes it is full and we have to look elsewhere and places are not there. That is the biggest worry that those who come forward, who are predominantly women, have when I meet them at my clinics. That conversation must happen and I know the Minister of State and his Department will look at that again. This is a step in the right direction. I thank Senator Martin for his work on this. We are proud to have co-signed it.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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Before I call on Senator Ruane, I welcome Councillor Peter McVitty and his wife and Senator Joe O'Reilly to the Chamber. I hope they enjoy their visit to Leinster House today.

Lynn Ruane (Independent)
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I thank the Green Party for this legislation. Issues around when a case gets to the court system, are another part of the area of coercive control that we need to address. I was in the Seanad Chamber when coercive control was added to the legislation. It was not easy at the time. A huge amount of work had to happen in the background.

Lynn Ruane (Independent)
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At the time Fine Gael did not see how it could work. It was worried about the complexities of it. Senators and advocacy bodies had to keep fighting to ensure coercive control was included. It has been shown and we now understand why it is so necessary for it to be in the legislation. Thinking about gender-based violence in general, the 3Arena has sold out only this week for an event people will pay lots of money to attend, to see someone who we know is a domestic abuser on stage singing. That same audience will criticise, judge and have a say on matters such as the recent attack on influencer Charlene Murphy who was attacked when she was out having dinner after she had been targeted with online abuse for weeks. We have a society that ignores domestic violence when a talented charismatic, good-looking man is the perpetrator. We ignore it. We support him and turn a blind eye. We even do so in our friend groups, families and communities. We have friends who we know and we observe to be engaging in coercive control. We need to ensure that when they get to the courts system, people are fully protected. I agree with Senator Ward about the hierarchy of rights, that people should not be allowed to cross-examine the person who has accused them. We have had to work hard to remove that from other places too. In the Family Courts, there was a push towards mediation and with regard to solicitors. We had to win an amendment in the last Seanad. The Government tried to make it mandatory to use mediation before moving on to see a solicitor. That was being written into legislation.Thankfully, it is not in legislation now. This is another part of it. As well as legislation such as this, some sort of public campaign is needed for people to understand what coercive control is and what it means for people's lives to even get to the point where they will go to court. If we will not hold people accountable in our lives, communities and spaces, how do we think a victim will think a court of law will hold somebody accountable, if their own family and friends do not hold the perpetrator accountable? We need to have conversations along those lines.

Refuges need investment, but we also need to acknowledge that the refuges are saying they have nowhere to move people on. Whether it is hotel accommodation, which is not ideal or being able to access housing through the housing assistance payment, HAP, system, through the county council, there is no progression for people to move into the refuge and on to safe accommodation, where they can rebuild their lives and families. Investing in refuges is one part, but we need to radically address the fact that we do not have accommodation for people who are fleeing domestic violence to be able to move into long term.

I welcome this legislation. It is very important. Somebody cross-examining a person who has accused them of coercive control is the State handing the abuser another way to coercively control. That is us giving the person a platform to coercively control in a court of law. I have supported people and have experience of coercive control. People have got off buses when they have seen somebody who even looks like the person who coercively controlled them; they get such a fright. Imagine having to go into a court of law, when one spends one's whole day trying to avoid people and the abuser gets the leisure to question and retraumatise that person. That is facilitated by the State. The legislation is very important, but we must remember that it sits in a suite of things we need to do, to radically address domestic violence in this country. I thank the Green Party.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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I am delighted to see the McVittys in the Chamber. I know them from a different job in which I was involved. We became good friends over the years. It is lovely to see them and I will have a word with them in a moment.

Like our Leader, Senator Gallagher, I am delighted to be here to support Senator Martin's Domestic Violence (Amendment) Bill 2023. I welcome the Minister of State, Deputy Browne, to the House. As Senator Gallagher has said, we will fully support this amendment. Why would we not? As a party, we are working constantly to try to make improvements in this sphere. Like all other Members who have spoken, I am always very affected by the many unlawful and brutal killings of women in this country. We wake up in the morning to hear that somebody has been brutally murdered. I know that men are attacked, but we have to acknowledge that this type of shocking domestic violence mainly affects women. We have to act together, as a group of politicians, to stamp this out, once and for all. These brutal deaths bring absolute horror to families and communities. Families never recover from such situations. One talks to families who have been hit by this and their lives are never the same again. Senator Hoey gave us extraordinary figures about the number of pregnant women who are affected. It is absolutely horrific to see that happening.

We need to reintroduce the word, "respect", throughout Irish society. I have spoken in recent weeks about the absolute disrespect for front-line workers; An Garda Síochána, nurses and teachers. It is rampant all over our society. We need to re-engage with the word, "respect". Some people go out on the streets and think they can throw a punch at anybody, for whatever reason. It an absolutely shocking indictment of society. We all need to re-engage with the word, "respect", and respect those we need to respect, whether it is gardaí or teachers and we should always show respect to women. I was brought up that way. I was brought up to open a door for a woman, whether it is right or wrong. Some people say one should not do it. Why not? Let us re-engage with the word, "respect". Let us support legislation such as this which, I hope, will get widespread support and coverage. It is badly needed and we need to deal with the matter, as a matter of urgency.

Aisling Dolan (Fine Gael)
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I support the Domestic Violence (Amendment) Bill. I thank Senator Martin for introducing it under Private Member's business. It is shocking, in all societies, that we are seeing this abuse and attacks against women, but I wish to speak to how we engage, at very early stages, to support women in coming forward about a domestic situation. There are always indications and symptoms and, yet, women put up with this type of aggression in the home. We are seeing other types of legislation coming through with regard to non-fatal strangulation and other elements, where we are ensuring that women have support in preventing the outcome of a domestic homicide. A domestic homicide review would need to happen.

It can be very hard for women in small towns in regional areas to come forward about domestic violence, for obvious reasons. The difference is not big, but in cities, there is a bit more anonymity and it can be easier for women to come forward. It can be very difficult in small towns to find someone to trust. One can be in very deep family networks with one's partner's family and so on.

It is important we are seeing supports from Tusla. I do not know whether the Minister of State will speak to refuge places. This has been raised before and I know the Minister of Justice has led on it. However, I reiterate that we do not have refuge places in the likes of our smaller towns of 6,000 or 10,000. We are fighting for them already in our cities, but we need to have those places to where women in a violent situation in the home can remove themselves, even for a few days. It will get them away from a dangerous situation, to a safe space. Such a refuge could be in an area local to where they are based. It is absolutely crucial.

I know the Bill is specifically around domestic homicide, but I wish to speak to the measures we need to put in place to support families in dangerous situations, before it gets to this point, because there are indications and symptoms. We need to be able to support women. I ask for an approach to be outlined. I know Tusla is looking at this, but that is under a different Department. I would appreciate the Minister of State's feedback on what we are doing under the Department of Justice.

Fiona O'Loughlin (Fianna Fail)
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I will not take six minutes, because I had the opportunity to speak extensively last week during statements on domestic violence, when the Minister, Deputy Harris, was here. However, this a very important Private Member's Bill for which I wished to come down to show my support. We are very pleased that the Minister of State, Deputy Browne, is supporting this important Bill. We talk about domestic violence and the statistics. We have heard the statistics here today and I had the opportunity to read them in to the record last week, but domestic violence obviously goes way beyond the statistics. Harrowing stories happen, are publicised and may be known, but a great many cases are not known about. Many women are living their daily lives being harassed and intimidated and that goes unchallenged.The scale is certainly extensive because very sadly and unfortunately there are some men in Ireland who believe women should be controlled, that those women should be submissive to them, and that violence and coercive control is an acceptable way of achieving those aims. Changing this requires a dramatic change in society, in the views of those men and in terms of what those men see as acceptable behaviour. Brighid McLaughlin had a very interesting article in last week'sSunday Independent . As we know, very sadly her sister died at the hands of her husband. She often writes about this issue. It is important that we hear from the families' perspectives, particularly regarding the parole issue. That is one of the suite of measures we need to look at. I commend Senator Martin on this Bill. He is my fellow Kildare man even if he is an adopted one.

Vincent P Martin (Green Party)
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Yes.

Fiona O'Loughlin (Fianna Fail)
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He is very welcome in our county and we acknowledge that. The measures that he is proposing are important and it is about protecting victims and protecting survivors from re-victimisation and re-traumatisation. Allowing the court to prohibit the accused from personally cross-examining victims and children when they are giving evidence during a trial is so important. It is quite barbaric when one thinks about it. It is important that this is accepted.

When we talk about the suite of measures in today's Irish Examinerthere is an article about the courts system. In some cases victims of domestic violence wait four months to be able to get a court safety order. It is evident that we need more judges but when one thinks of that postcode lottery in terms of looking for a safety order to protect oneself and one's children, it is simply not good enough that in this day and age it can take up to four months. When we talk about the suite of measures, that is one of the areas that has to be looked at as well. I thank the Minister for his time and appreciate it.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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Before we proceed I wish to remind Senators that on the Order of Business this morning we agreed this item would adjourn at 5 p.m. I am conscious the Minister of State needs time to come back to make a statement and I am conscious the proposer needs to speak also. I am also conscious that Senators Conway, Chambers, Ahearn and Joe O'Reilly have yet to speak. Sharing is a suggestion. Finally Senator Seery Kearney is to speak so if we could tighten it up to possibly four minutes.

Lisa Chambers (Fianna Fail)
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How long do we get to speak for normally?

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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It is normally six minutes.

Lisa Chambers (Fianna Fail)
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I am happy to share with Senator Seery Kearney at three minutes each.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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Senator Conway will proceed and Senator Joe O'Reilly will share with him.

Martin Conway (Fine Gael)
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I thank the Acting Chair. Everybody needs to speak on this very important issue. I thank Senator Martin for his briefing and it cleared up a couple of concerns I had. There were concerns because I thought the Bill might not have gone far enough or may not have been strong enough but once the rationale was explained in terms of the "shall" and the "may" it made absolute sense because the last thing we want is to go backwards.

This legislation is designed to bring us forward. It may not be as forward as we would like but it is absolutely an incremental step in the right direction and I commend the Senator for it. I also commend Senator Martin for being able to persuade the Cabinet and Government to accept the Bill. I remember back here particularly in 2013 when I tried to bring a piece of legislation it could not even get off the ground because the Cabinet would not agree with it, so I think that is an achievement in its own right. It is the way politics should be. When something makes sense and when something is absolutely the right thing to do then it should happen. I sincerely hope we will see this Bill pass all Stages in the Seanad without delay and that it will then go through Dáil Éireann without delay because it is critical. We cannot have a situation where the perpetrator of a crime of this nature can turn around and cross-examine the victim and completely re-traumatise them. That cannot happen and this legislation is designed to make sure that would not happen. I commend it and I think everybody here will be very supportive of it.

On another issue, in this morning's Irish ExaminerCiara Phelan had an article about delays in terms of cases going through the courts system. That is very worrying because justice delayed in this type of situation is very traumatising. There should be and needs to be a separate avenue through the courts system for people who suffer domestic violence and who are brave enough to go to the Garda and to allow the case to go through the judicial system. The courts system needs to react accordingly and facilitate a quick passage for these cases. In Clare it is an eight-week delay which is two months. That is still too long. It should be eight days, not eight weeks. At least in Clare it is not as bad as it is nationally but the national average is very worrying and that is something the Minister of State, his officials and his Department can deal with very quickly. I am conscious of time so I will defer to my colleague, Senator Joe O'Reilly.

Joe O'Reilly (Fine Gael)
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I will be very brief and I thank Senator Conway for sharing time. I strongly support my colleague, Senator Martin, on the legislation and what he is trying to achieve here. I congratulate him on his enormous achievement that he has gained the acceptance of the Government. It is a tribute to his competencies and capacities that he is able to produce legislation that can be accepted in that fashion. It very rarely happens.

I agree that coercive control is one of the horrors of society. It is correct that we should not re-victimise the victims and make life progressively more difficult for them again. On that premise I support and congratulate my colleague. This is great legislation. We are all very proud of what he has achieved and he certainly speaks for all of us. I hope the Minister of State can give this Bill a speedy enactment.

Lisa Chambers (Fianna Fail)
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I am happy to share time with Senator Seery Kearney.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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Senators will have three to four minutes and we will come back to Senator Ahearn.

Lisa Chambers (Fianna Fail)
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I am happy to support this Bill as tabled by Senator Martin and of course reiterate the support of my party, Fianna Fáil, for the Bill.The legislation is very appropriate. We have a relatively new criminal offence of coercive control on the Statute Book and the law in terms of protection of victims in terms of the core process has not yet caught up. This Bill is trying to bridge that gap. I am very happy to support the Bill and I commend Senator Martin for bringing it forward to the House.

While we have the opportunity, it does allow us to discuss issues pertaining to domestic violence, violence against women and sexual crimes. The article in the Irish Examineraround court delays has been referred to. It is quite obvious that we do not have enough judges to deal with the case work that is coming through. The Minister of State will be very aware of the saying that justice delayed is justice denied, so for the predominantly women who are waiting for months on end to get to court it is a very precarious position to be in for starters. It is a very traumatising position to be in and it exacerbates the situation so we need to deal with the significant delays in the court process.

I want to flag another issue with the Minister of State. I will be cautious in how I speak about this issue and will not put any particular names on the record. We are all very aware that in recent times there is a particular judge who has come to the attention of the public. I will not say the judge's name but we all know who I am speaking about. It has raised particular concerns over what appears to be extremely lenient sentences when it comes to violent crimes, often sexually motivated crimes, perpetrated by men against women. Many of these convicted criminals are getting suspended sentences or very light sentences and mitigating factors are being cited by a particular judge as the reason the sentence is so lenient. Noeline Blackwell of the Dublin Rape Crisis Centre has been quite strong on this issue. She hit the nail on the head when she said that justice does not appear to have been done in these cases. If we look at the number of cases that are in the category I referred to where the sentences appear to be very lenient. There was a recent case. If I speak about the case detail I will identify the person. The crime was severe and the assault perpetrated against the woman was appalling. I can only imagine the lifelong trauma she will endure.One of the perpetrators walked out of court with a suspended sentence and did not look in any way sorrowful about his crimes.

Work was done previously on having a sentencing database so we could see if there was some sort of pattern. We do not have enough data currently to know whether a judge is operating in isolation or whether his or her decisions are the norm and in step with those of other judges. We do not know whether there is a pattern because we do not have the information or data. My request to the Minister of State on this issue is that we re-start the work on establishing a sentencing database so we can have transparency for citizens on the types of sentences handed down for crimes, particularly those against women.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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There are two more speakers. We have until 5 p.m. We can adjourn then if we have not concluded but I believe we could conclude this business today. I call Senator Seery Kearney, who is to be followed by Senator Ahearn.

Mary Seery Kearney (Fine Gael)
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I commend my colleague, Senator Martin, and thank him most sincerely for the opportunity to be a co-sponsor of this Bill. It is incredibly important that a complainant in a case of coercive control not be cross-examined by the person she is accusing. It runs contrary to the very definition of coercive control that it could be perpetuated within the applications in respect of domestic violence.

Having reflected on Senator Chambers' comments, I completely endorse and support them. Ms Noeline Blackwell has been absolutely unambiguous on the subject, and I completely endorse and support her remarks also. There has been commentary from the Judiciary, or on behalf of it, on the parameters of sentencing. The scope of the Judiciary is sometimes fettered and it is obliged to do an all-or-nothing in some instances. Concurrent with establishing a database or other mechanism, we also need to ask whether there is merit to what I am saying and, if so, address the matter as a matter of urgency. Amendments could be tagged on to other criminal justice Bills that are coming through.

In other areas, we are dealing with domestic violence leave. Women's Aid has said we should not be advocating 70% pay and that there should be full pay for women and others who apply for domestic violence leave. If a woman avails of domestic violence leave and has reduced pay, it may show up in her bank account. This could show her hand, particularly where there is coercive control. Management of money is a big indicator. In the context of this debate, I endorse the call by Women's Aid. I absolutely support it.

We need to be considering prevention and education and tackling people when they are young. The recent report on access to pornography and inappropriate matter online by children is quite horrific. What they are exposed to is quite horrific. The misogyny expressed by influencers on social media is really quite horrific. We need to tackle it in an absolute way as legislators, and we also need to have a major education programme in our schools. That is also a called by Women's Aid that I completely endorse.

Garret Ahearn (Fine Gael)
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I commend my colleague, Senator Martin, on this amending legislation, which I fully support. I agree with comments made by Senator Chambers. It is hard enough to convince people, particularly women, to report a crime but it is worse if, at the end of the process, they and the public see justice has not prevailed. It is disheartening for the individual, at the very least. It will put people off in the future if those who commit the crimes are not brought to justice – to real justice. This is the sort of subject on which statements should be made by the judicial system. I am aware that there is separation of powers between the political and judicial systems, for obvious reasons, but this is just common sense. It needs to be stated.

There is just one part of the Bill on which I want to speak. It relates to section 39(4) of the Domestic Violence Act. I met representatives of an amazing organisation in Clonmel called Cuan Saor Women's Refuge, which is right across the road from my office in town. My mother officially opened it when she was a Deputy 20-odd years ago. It does phenomenal work. One of the challenges it is facing now is that while coercive control does not just happen between intimate partners, intimate partners are the only ones who can be prosecuted at present. The organisation is seeing a massive increase in coercive control involving siblings, including brothers, fathers and even mothers. There is nothing in particular it can do about it and has asked that something be done legislatively to acknowledge what is happening. Subsection 39(4) of the existing legislation states a "relevant person" must be a spouse or former intimate partner. We need to recognise now that it goes beyond that. I would be interested in hearing the Minister of State's thoughts on that.

I acknowledge the work of my colleague Senator Martin on the Bill. It has my full support.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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The Minister of State has up to 15 minutes. I do not want to put him under any pressure. I am sure he will need most of the time.

James Browne (Wexford, Fianna Fail)
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Is the debate to adjourn at 5 p.m.?

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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Yes.

James Browne (Wexford, Fianna Fail)
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I will say what needs to be said but leave enough time for Senator Martin.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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Senator Martin will then have some time in which to respond. Under the Order of Business agreed today, we have to adjourn at 5 p.m. Finishing before then is the alternative.

James Browne (Wexford, Fianna Fail)
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I am pleased to have the opportunity to address the Seanad on behalf of the Minister for Justice, Deputy Harris. I thank Senator Martin for introducing this important Private Member's Bill on Second Stage today. I acknowledge the co-sponsorship of the Bill by a large number of Senators and the eloquent contributions made by all the speakers.

The stated aim of the Bill is to amend the Domestic Violence Act to provide protection for victims and children in proceedings on coercive control. By protecting victims, including children, from cross-examination in person by the accused, the Bill moves to reduce the retraumatisation that may occur in a courtroom setting. Earlier this week, the Minister, Deputy Harris, brought a memo to the Government seeking Cabinet approval not to oppose the Bill on Second Stage. I am happy to confirm it was endorsed by the Cabinet.

The intention of the Bill aligns with the Government's zero-tolerance approach to domestic, sexual and gender-based violence. Coercive control is an appalling crime, a form of abuse that frequently has severe and lasting consequences. Its victims have often had incredibly difficult personal journeys. They deserve to feel safe and supported when coming forward and throughout their engagement with the criminal justice system. However, we must also remember that the right to a fair trial is enshrined in the Constitution and is a cornerstone of our legal system. In our common law system, the criminal trial is a binary contest between the prosecution and the defence. The procedure and evidential rules that have evolved over time are based on that assumption. An accused person has a right to test the evidence given against him, and examination and cross-examination are part of that process. This can understandably be a difficult experience for a victim, particularly when asked to recall the details of a traumatic experience. Nevertheless, it is a core element of our legal system.

A key requirement in criminal trials is to ensure that the accuser and the accusation can be probed in front of the trier of fact. Any interference with the right to a fair trial must be proportionate. It must go no further than necessary to achieve its purpose. In 2017, the Oireachtas addressed this issue with amendments to the Criminal Evidence Act. This gave the court the power to direct that an accused not personally cross-examine the victim in a sexual offence case. Provision was made for a legal representative of the accused to conduct that cross-examination.The Attorney General's office concluded this did not infringe the accused's right to an adequate and proper opportunity to question and challenge a witness. The legislation also contained very important safeguards. Any prejudice to the accused person must be avoided by a warning to the jury, if necessary. It also permits cross-examination in person where the court feels it is deemed to be in the interests of justice. Given these provisions expressly covered victims of sexual offences, they were deemed to be proportionate. The rationale for bringing forward this important legislation in 2017 was to protect vulnerable victims from revictimisation in the courtroom. The same logic clearly applies to victims of coercive control which was criminalised in 2018. Equally, it applies to victims of other offences such as forced marriage, stalking and harassment, and I want to ensure victims do not fear engaging with the justice system.

I have asked my officials to identify the protections available to vulnerable victims and where these can be strengthened in the context of our ongoing work in this area. It is important this is being done in a comprehensive manner to take account of both existing and forthcoming legislation. I have been advised by the Attorney General's office that it would be more coherent to provide for an extension of the existing power in the Criminal Evidence Act 1992 itself. Once the preparatory work has been completed, it is intended to bring forward legislation to do this very thing.

I assure the Senators that, in the meantime, there is ongoing work in my Department to strengthen protections for vulnerable victims. Last July, the Government approved the general scheme of the criminal justice (sexual offences and human trafficking) Bill to implement the recommendations of the O’Malley review of protections for vulnerable witnesses in the investigation and prosecution of sexual offences. This legislation will strengthen the rights of victims of sexual offences to ensure anonymity for victims in all trials for sexual offences, and will extend victims' rights to separate legal representation. The Minister, Deputy Harris, and I expect to be in a position to publish this Bill later this spring. In supporting the victim’s journey, with the plan to implement the recommendations of the O’Malley review, we are putting important reforms in place to support and protect vulnerable victims in sexual offence cases and to ensure our criminal justice system is more victim-orientated.

The introduction of preliminary trial hearings has helped to increase efficiency in how trials are run, which will reduce delays and ease the process for victims. Work has also commenced in developing training for all personnel who come into contact with vulnerable victims. In addition, the University of Limerick has been commissioned to develop a framework for the operation and training of intermediaries. To promote more sustainable service delivery and planning, my Department is also offering multi-annual funding commitments to key NGOs working in this area. These grants cover accompaniment to court, to Garda interviews and to sexual assault treatment units, as well as emotional support and counselling. The nationwide roll-out of the divisional protective service units ensure vulnerable victims are dealt with by gardaí who have specialist expertise.

I am also bringing forward important legislative provisions with regard to stalking and harassment in the forthcoming Criminal Justice (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill which will, for the first time in Irish law, establish the stand-alone offence of stalking. This offence will cover any conduct that puts someone in fear of violence or causes serious alarm and distress which has an adverse effect on a person’s day-to-day life. The Bill will also significantly widen the existing harassment offence. This offence will remain important, covering harassment behaviours that are broader than simply stalking.

This is a part of a much broader body of work my Department is undertaking to combat domestic, sexual and gender-based violence and to keep our communities, especially women and girls, safe. In particular, in June of last year, the Minister, Deputy McEntee, published the third national strategy on domestic, sexual and gender-based violence, our zero tolerance strategy. It is an ambitious five-year programme of reform to achieve a society that does not accept domestic, sexual, and gender-based violence or the attitudes which underpin it.

I reiterate the Government’s commitment to protecting vulnerable victims and assure Senators of my dedication in this regard. I am grateful to Senator Martin for bringing forward this Bill and I note the support it has received from the House. As I have outlined, work is under way in my Department to strengthen protections for vulnerable victims. I intend to bring forward an amendment to the Criminal Evidence Act to ensure the protection against cross-examination in person is available in respect of a number of offences, including but not limited to coercive control. This will ensure vulnerable victims are not retraumatised in the courtroom by being cross-examined by their abuser.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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I thank the Minister of State. I appreciate there was a time constraint on him there and I very much appreciate his contribution. I call Senator Martin to speak now as he may wish to reply. I am also conscious that I must put the question by 5 o’clock so that we can conclude this process. I give the floor to the Senator for two to three minutes.

Vincent P Martin (Green Party)
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Closing comments would usually include some rebuttal remarks but the House is more or less agreed. There are no divisions, so with the leave of the House, may I share my time with Senator O’Reilly?

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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The Senator may but there are only two minutes remaining because we must adjourn at 5 o’clock.

Vincent P Martin (Green Party)
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I appreciate that. I thank the Minister for his kind remarks, as I do those of other Senators from across the House. This is much appreciated. This collaborative approach is something I am into in a big way and it is the best way forward.

This Bill, by curtailing and restricting the right to cross-examine, makes victims more central in our consideration. In a victim’s consideration of coming forward to make a complaint or to testify in court, more assurance, greater confidence and some peace of mind is afforded the victim that an accused person’s right to cross-examine her or him - because it can be either - in person is not guaranteed. It will be restricted and curtailed in accordance with law and in the interests of justice. It is important to protect victims against the additional serious trauma of the possibly intimidating prospect of an accused person conducting such a cross-examination.

In the time left I was going to conclude by going back to this provision of protection for the first time in sexual offences cases. Our good friend and former Senator, Deputy Ivana Bacik, said:

We are carrying out research in Trinity College Dublin into the real trauma that can be caused to complainants where a defendant chooses to cross-examine in person. Currently there is no such restriction in Irish law.

She called for greater movement and reform in this area. She was ahead of the people’s thinking in that respect and I acknowledge former Senator Bacik, who was speaking then in 2017.

I hand over now to my colleague, Senator Pauline O’Reilly, with whom I will leave the last words in this debate.

Pauline O'Reilly (Green Party)
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I will be very brief. I congratulate my colleague, Senator Martin, on pursuing this and I give very significant thanks to Noeline Blackwell for all her work, not only on legislation but also in advocacy down through the years. It is quite interesting that so much legislation on violence against women, in particular - it is predominantly women who are impacted by this legislation - has come through the Seanad in our term. We are almost seeing a snowball effect now. I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Browne, so much for taking this on board and for putting it into Government legislation. It was a very significant step forward to have coercive control seen as a criminal offence, but my colleague is completely right in that, the more we can do to ensure people feel they can step forward and feel unafraid to go into our courts, the more we can address this insidious level of violence against women we have at the moment.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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I thank Senator O’Reilly and Senator Martin. The Senators appreciate the time constraint under the Order of Business to conclude by 5 o’clock.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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When is it proposed to take Committee Stage?

Vincent P Martin (Green Party)
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Next Tuesday.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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Is that agreed? Agreed.