Mary Seery Kearney (Fine Gael)
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I welcome the announcement that the Government has reversed the decision in Killarney. It was a very welcome development that, once it was drawn to the attention of Government, it operated in a very humane and quick way. It is regrettable it got to that stage. However, I very much appreciate and welcome that this morning.

When we began welcoming and supporting the families fleeing Ukraine due to this horrific and illegal war, we anticipated a six-month timeframe and we talked in these terms when families were asked to open their homes and support Ukrainians coming to Ireland. I appreciate that the situation escalated and continues to go on.In the last few days there have been further atrocities with bombings and missile strikes on Kyiv, and on Lviv only yesterday. The war in Ukraine will go on for much longer than we anticipated or hoped and I appreciate that the war has put staff and certainly the officials in the Department under huge pressure. I wish to pay tribute to departmental staff, particularly those in Citywest whom I know work extraordinary hours and well beyond what normally is demanded as part of their job descriptions because of their sheer passion for supporting Ukrainian families.

I tabled this matter long before what happened in Killarney. In the last few weeks a number of families have approached me to tell me that the Ukrainians who are staying with them are worried that as their six months stay is coming to an end they will have to return to Ukraine or wonder what is the best course of action. I know of one instance that occurred in a conversation I had last night where I learned that one mother had informed the school attended by her children that the family would be leaving because their accommodation was going to finish this month and that situation had consequences for SNA hours for a child.

There is uncertainty with regard to Ukrainians staying with families. Perhaps there are Irish families who initially opened up their homes and now need to be assured that support will continue, and to have certainty that the Government is engaged with the ongoing plight of the Ukrainians and will provide families with supports.

My main question is about communication. I appreciate that this is a fluid situation and that everyone does their best but clarity is absent. Can the Department ask people to extend their accommodation for a further six months? The State has committed to at least a further six months but I contend that ideally the period should be a year because Ukrainians would have no homes to return to even if the war ends. I believe that there is a necessity for us to visit the fact that those initial commitment periods are now ending and, therefore, a solution must be provided. Will people be housed elsewhere? I would prefer if people could stay where they are because they have already come from trauma and are only a short period in Ireland. I would prefer if people were allowed to stay where they are as they have now built up networks, taken jobs and are part of a community. We certainly have a desire and a need to communicate stability and clarity in order to give Ukrainians some level of certainty and comfort.

Roderic O'Gorman (Dublin West, Green Party)
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I thank the Senator for raising this important matter in terms of the operation of the pledge process.

Since the outbreak of the war in Ukraine on 24 February, and the activation of the temporary protection directive shortly afterwards, my Department has worked intensively as part of the cross-governmental response to the Ukraine crisis. My Department is focused on the immediate, short-term accommodation needs of those who fled here. To date, 52,000 people have arrived in Ireland from Ukraine of which more than 41,000 people are being accommodated by my Department and we are also accommodating people in the international protection process. All of that creates real challenges in terms of the delivery of accommodation and I think that we are all aware of that.

The Government is committed to delivering a humanitarian response to the needs of people from Ukraine and providing shelter and safety for these individuals. The response by the public has been huge. We have seen that in communities all around the country but we have particularly seen it in the context of the pledge process. Early on we put in place a pledge process with the Irish Red Cross and a very significant number of pledges were made. We have worked closely with a number of implementation partners such as the International Organization for Migration, the Peter McVerry Trust and all 31 local authorities.

I note that there were some initial delays with the pledge process but by and large it has worked well. At this point over 4,500 Ukrainians have been accommodated around the country. More than 10% of the Ukrainians that the State is accommodating are accommodated in accommodation that was pledged.

As Senators will know, earlier this year my Department introduced the €400 recognition payment. The payment is just recognition and gives some support to the families who have either pledged vacant accommodation or rooms within their own home. The payment has been availed of by 3,500 applicants who are hosting over 7,500 Ukrainians. Again, we made the payment open not just to those who had gone through the official pledge process but those who brought Ukrainians into their homes through other channels.

Obviously we would hope that at the end of a six-month pledge period a family would look to extend the period and we would look to support that. However, that may not always be possible. Where an arrangement comes to an end the implementation partners, whom I referenced earlier, will work with the Ukrainian beneficiaries and the local authorities to seek alternative pledged accommodation. Where this is not possible then the beneficiaries will have to return to our transit hub in Citywest for the allocation of suitable alternative State-sourced accommodation. We will try to do what the Senator said is the preferred option, which is to locate people somewhere local but we can make no commitments to do that.

I have to be very upfront in terms of the difficulties being experienced and pressures on my Department. What happened yesterday in Killarney is another example of that very real and immediate pressure that the Department is under to provide accommodation. We cannot give guarantees but we will always do our best. This morning, we were able to find a solution for the Killarney situation but there is no guarantee that a solution can be found for every situation. That reflects the unprecedented scale of this crisis and the uncertainty because in the last month the number of Ukrainians arriving has doubled from 700 a week at the start of September to 1,500 a week, which puts real pressure on international protection. We are operating to try and move people into alternative pledged accommodation where their pledged accommodation has come to an end or to extend the pledges. We will do our best but we cannot give guarantees.

I take the point the Senator made about communication and communication is important. We can do better in terms of communication on the Department side.

Mary Seery Kearney (Fine Gael)
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I acknowledge the exceptional welcome and generous actions by Irish people.

An issue arose in Killarney because the accommodation was continuing but with replacement people which created a curious and unnecessary situation. If there is a family who have completed their six-month pledge of accommodation and genuinely do not want to renew then that is fine but people will need to be relocated to wherever there is accommodation. I am sure we all appreciate that the spirit is to accommodate as much as possible.

I urge that families are communicated with and asked whether their pledge of accommodation is open-ended or whether they can commit for another six months. I make that suggestion because at least if people sign up their accommodation for another six months then the Ukrainian people staying with them will have certainty, particularly as these Ukrainian people are already in a precarious position. This is not a leasehold arrangement, and neither should it be, but extending the pledge will give people clarity and certainty. In addition, language difficulties will lead to a further anomaly.

I appreciate that the Minister has committed to ensuring there is communication.

Roderic O'Gorman (Dublin West, Green Party)
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An extension of a further six months provides very real certainty to Ukrainians and provides certainty to my Department. We are seeing situations where pledges have ended and people have had to go to Citywest thus requiring us to find new accommodation for them. We will find new accommodation for people but such movement adds to the pressures on the Department. I will certainly look for my pledge team to place some of its focus on the renewal of pledges while at the same time look to develop further pledges.

In terms of Killarney, the key point is that we seek two types of accommodation at all times - accommodation for Ukrainians and accommodation for international protection. It is incredibly difficult to source accommodation for international protection. We had to avail of the opportunity at the hotel in Killarney because we all saw what happened when we did not secure enough accommodation and international protection applicants ended up sleeping rough on our streets.This is a situation I wish to avoid repeating but I cannot give that guarantee because the housing situation is so incredibly tight right now. This is the vista I am looking at. It is for this reason and this reason alone that the Department proposed to move the Ukrainians from Killarney to Westport. In this situation we have been able to find alternative accommodation in Killarney for them and they will be moved there shortly.