Victor Boyhan (Independent)

One thing about this Bill is in respect of those who are excluded. There are too many people excluded from this legislation. The Minister talks about Sage and I welcome all of that, and also the advocate. This morning I had a Commencement matter in respect of Westbank in Greystones, at the heart of the Tánaiste's constituency. I have a substantial file on communication and promises by people in respect of Westbank. They have been excluded. We know that the mother and baby homes commission recommended they be included. We get these grand responses saying that they can be added in the Schedule of the redress. We are winding down. Caranua is being wound down today under this legislation. Why is that happening? To link the matter to this particular amendment, it is about the resources for this counselling and support service. It is because the State did not pursue the religious orders who signed up to the indemnity scheme, of which I have a copy in front of me, for the money that was due. If the Minister or anyone else was owed money they would be chasing it up. There is a softly, softly approach in terms of responding.

If someone tells me one more time that we have spent €1 billion - I do not care what anyone has spent. It is about justice, healing, redress and acknowledgement. So many people tell me the same story and I tell it to myself, that one day I will be free to tell my story and one day I will be believed. Every victim, survivor or affected person through abuse in institutions or schools, be they State, religious or neither, will want to be believed. The liberation of knowing you can come with your head high and say, "What happened to me was not because of me. I did not contribute to it." You cannot put a price on that. The State has to put in place some resource that will help people to navigate. I said this morning that it is a long road with many turns and setbacks. People need to be assisted to navigate that road. Far too many people have been broken down and destroyed. Far too many of our people have had to get out of this country, to run away to nothing, just to run away and forget their past. We owe it to them. I am committed. My political life for however long I am here will be committed to advocating for quality of justice. We have to have justice for people. We have to believe in people and support them.

I get from the Minister and others this premise about the cost, that we spent so much money. Yes, we spent a lot of money but we are talking about a generation in their 50s, 60s and 70s, many of them with health issues and challenges. Let us not compromise on this issue of support. The Minister talks about collaboration and I welcome that. I want her to ask the Minister, Deputy Foley, this week whether she will agree to publish the special advocate report that is on her desk. In that report, if we had it today, we could make stronger cases. There is a report on the Minister, Deputy Foley's desk. She is considering it. I am not suggesting she is doing anything more sinister than that. If I had it in my hand today I could stand up here and put it into the public domain. I have a fair idea what is in it. It is shocking and challenging. Timing is everything in the parliamentary political process when we are bringing in legislation.

Going back to what Senator Stephenson says in this amendment, we must unequivocally send out a message that we are committed to Sage, to the principle of a special advocate, and to the principle of expanding the role and remit of that special advocate to help people journey on their way to get the supports they absolutely need.