Cathal Byrne (Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

Like my colleagues, I welcome this Bill. I want to highlight a number of specific things in section 5. Like so many people, I have tended to avail of having my bank card on my phone and making payments through Apple Pay. I notice that when I seek cashback from, for example, a petrol station that is not possible when using contactless payment through Apple Pay. I understand the Bill seeks primarily to deal with ATMs, but it is also important that we recognise the fact that while there are traditional ATMs, where people insert a bank card and put in a pin code, in an era when most people have adopted a model of paying through Apple Pay and having an ATM card on their phone, it should be recognised that the ATMs made available have to be modernised and move with the times. There should be availability through Apple Pay and Google Pay to withdraw cash at ATMs. I would like the Minister of State's Department to delve a bit more into the detail on that and see whether it is possible to ensure that the ATMs addressed in the Bill can incorporate contactless withdrawals. Perhaps there is a mechanism to link with banks on that area.

When people avail of cashback through petrol stations, will that count as cash being made available? Will cashback services through petrol stations be incorporated into the percentage of areas that have cash availability? Is the legislation strictly limited to physical ATMs?

In the Bill, is an ATM defined as one that has withdrawal facilities or will there be a corresponding mechanism for lodgements? I am aware that in some larger banks ATMs allow people to withdraw and lodge cash. While we are encouraging people to make use of cash, from a business perspective businesses need to be able to lodge cash. I am aware that the post office network offers that facility. Many businesses that deal in cash do not want to keep it overnight because of insurance considerations. The ATMs we will require to be available for consumer use should also have a corresponding requirement for lodgements.

I welcome the provision in section 5 regarding the Central Bank. In the context of the report it is to deliver under the Bill, it is proposed that, should there be a reduction in cash demand of more than 15% in a calendar year, as part of the review process there must be a consultation. It is important that the consultation incorporates bodies representing the interests of consumers, people with disabilities, elderly persons and the owners of SMEs, in particular those in the retail and hospitality sectors. The reality is that they are the people who find it very difficult to access ATMs. If the Bill is to be a success, it is important that those who may find it difficult to make their way to an ATM in a rural location are involved in consultation on where ATMs are to be located and that they are located in areas where they are accessible to people with disabilities or mobility challenges or the elderly.

I refer to post offices which allow withdrawals from bank accounts. I am aware that people can withdraw cash from AIB or Bank of Ireland through the post office network. Will that count as being an area which has access to cash, despite the fact that some of those in the area may not have a post office account?Will those post offices count towards the percentage of areas that are covered by this legislation or are they outside its remit and there will have to be a functioning ATM? Those are the points I wanted to highlight under this section.