Barry Ward (Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I congratulate the Minister of State on the legislation. This is a very important Bill. It is also a very weighty one, containing 220 sections. The job it is designed to do is a mammoth one, so it is very important.

It is quite shocking that up to now we have not had proper regulation of such an enormous industry. I acknowledge that it is an enormous industry, not just in terms of the companies providing the services but also the ancillary industries that depend on it. Nothing in this legislation should be employed to damage industries, although, having listened to the news headlines this morning, I am conscious that one gambling company enjoyed a 16% increase in its revenue in the first quarter of this year. Those who make extraordinary profits from this industry need to conscious of the damage they could do. They must also be aware of the social impact of what they do.

I particularly welcome the provision in Chapter 4 of a social impact fund, which is a very positive measure and one that will create a little more balance regarding the relative strengths of the industry and those who avail of the services it provides.A number of my colleagues have identified issues, and maybe unintended consequences, which arise from this Bill. The Minister of State has communicated that there will be amendments forthcoming on Committee Stage in this House and I welcome that. I hope they will deal with a lot of the issues that my colleagues have raised.

I wish to raise a couple of those unintended consequences that need to be looked at in the context of Committee Stage in the coming months. I refer to the impact they might have which no one actually wants to see, while at the same time ensuring the regulation of gambling in general in Ireland.

First, I have a question for the Minister of State. I may be exposing my own ignorance in this regard. In section 80 and 81, there is a provision on regulations. Throughout the Bill, there are occasions in which specific monetary limits are included in terms of stakes or winnings or whatever it might be. Reference has been made to them by other speakers already. I am not sure about the wisdom of putting strict monetary limits into the Bill. In my view, that would require an amendment to the Bill further down the line to change those limits as circumstances change, whether that be inflation or otherwise. We do not know what is coming down the line in the future in that regard.

However, there are specific provisions in section 81(2), which is in Part 5, that give the regulator or the authority the power to make regulations with the consent of the Minister to vary the amounts of maximum relevant payments, for example. I do not understand how that works. Maybe the Minister of State can explain, if there is a specific amount listed, and there are a number of specific monetary amounts in the Schedules to the Bill, how they can be varied by regulation if they are in a primary legislative instrument. How can they be varied by a secondary legislative instrument? I am not sure how that works. If it can be done, then I do not have a problem with it.

Generally speaking, we should be establishing a regulator which has real powers, but also real discretion. The regulator will have a huge job. She has been put in place and is ready to hit the ground running which is also welcome. We should be affording her the powers to make decisions that will have a real impact where she needs them to have an impact, rather than having prescriptive measures included in the Bill. Wherever possible, we should be affording her discretion to deal with limits and whatever else it may be in terms of the regulations that she may have the power to deal with.

Bingo is another issue which has also been raised by other speakers. It appears that bingo would be substantially affected by this legislation and I do not believe that is the intention of the Bill because bingo is quite apart from many of the kind of gambling games or activities that are described in the Bill. It is actually a pro-social activity. Often, different generations come together to play in a pretty wholesome and healthy environment and to indulge in a game in which, generally speaking, the stakes are relatively small. There is a danger that some of the restrictions which have been put into the Bill will make the game of bingo unviable for both the provider and the people who actually play it. I hope the Minister of State will give consideration to that important social activity that exists throughout Ireland. I saw a group of retired people playing bingo in the middle of the afternoon in a community centre in Newtownpark Avenue yesterday. It is a lovely event for people to be able to be involved in and I would not want this Bill to restrict its operation.

A number of people have also raised with the Minister of State the impact the Bill will have on charitable raffles that do important fundraising for social and sports clubs throughout the country. Many people have brought that to the Minister's attention and I understand there is a solution coming to that on Committee Stage in terms of amendments and I look forward to that as well.

There is a provision in section 173 which essentially disallows the withdrawal of cash on the premises from an ATM or other such machine. I understand the impetus behind that in a situation where there might be a person with a gambling problem. Much of our approach to regulating gambling has been about creating an environment where those who have a difficulty with problem gambling are not placed in an insidious position where they are tempted, encouraged or preyed upon. Obviously, the danger surrounds people who have a particular problem and who have an ATM next to where they potentially gamble; they could, therefore, continue to take out massive amounts of money to their detriment and potentially the detriment of their families. I understand where this is coming from but there is an unintended consequence coming from that particular provision. To use the example of bingo, an elderly person will potentially be sent out to the street next to the bingo hall where an ATM could legally be provided to withdraw cash to bring it back into the bingo hall. This, therefore, would expose them to other consequences, potentially. That is something that I do not believe is intended with the Bill and I ask the Minister of State to give consideration to that.A concern has been expressed to me by a number of people that some of the provisions in the Bill would have the unfortunate consequence of reducing the offering available to people and then potentially encouraging black market, underground or unregulated gambling activity which, of course, would be illegal. I am wondering to what extent has the Minister of State proofed the elements that are in the Bill to make sure they do not encourage black market gambling or whatever it might be.

The provisions in section 138 of the Bill deal with advertising, including paid advertising, relating to gambling, which is a huge problem. It is a problem that exists in the ordinary broadcast media but, significantly, online as well. I welcome the fact that the Bill tries to deal with that but I wonder, in the context of what I said earlier, if this is a job for the regulator. She could be given the discretion that she needs to deal with advertising in whatever way she thinks appropriate, rather than the Bill being overly prescriptive in respect of the matter and at the risk of potentially having a situation where what is in the Bill is not functional or useful, or, worse, has the opposite effect and restricts certain elements in a way that is not foreseen or intended by the Bill. Perhaps the Minister of State will give consideration to that.

Another element I wanted to mention is the provision of the gambling exclusion register in Chapter 3. That is a welcome and progressive element but I wonder about the practicalities of it. The burden clearly falls on a company, individual or whatever it might be who is providing a gambling service - I do not have a difficulty with that - but consideration should be given to the extent to which it is practicable for them. I do not want to talk about bingo all night but do people coming into a venue-----