Barry Ward (Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

Cuirim fáilte roimh an Tánaiste. Gabhaim buíochas leis as ucht a bheith anseo don díospóireacht thábhachtach seo. I want to respond to the last speech in which it was asserted that the approach in this motion is somehow not condemnatory of China. It is very clear from the words used, expressing concern and opposition and outlining a list of serious issues, including coerced testimony in the context of Jimmy Lai's trial, and referring to repression of the independent media, destruction of the culture in the context of Tibet, genocide being perpetrated in Xinjiang, and the repression of religious minorities, that this is not a mealy-mouthed motion. The motion and its intent are very clear in terms of what is said.

Senator Malcolm Byrne and I are co-chairs of the Inter-Parliamentary Alliance on China. These are issues we have been pursuing for a number of years now and feel very strongly about. However, it is important to distinguish, as other speakers have, between the Chinese people, for whom I have enormous respect, and their government, for whom I have very little respect.

The reality is that we sit in a Eurocentric world and we think that things started here. Most of the things here started in China - from games, through ideas, to all the other things we take for granted. The Chinese have given the world so much and it is a culture of such ancient calibre that it is almost difficult for us to understand it. It is their misfortune that they now find themselves governed by the Chinese Communist Party, which has little or no respect for their individuality, their innovation and their might. It is repressing its own people, to the detriment of the progress of China. That is what is really regrettable about this.

My colleagues in Lithuania have been incredibly strong in opposing China and the way it has behaved. It is however important to acknowledge that it is slightly easier for them because they do not have the same trade relationship with China. Whether we like it or not, we are the only European Union country with a trade surplus with China. In 2023, that surplus was to the tune of some €24 million, so China is an important trade partner for us. Of course, it is right to point that out and identify the risks and difficulties it would potentially pose for us. If we create a dependency on Chinese trade, we are putting ourselves into a straitjacket in potentially being unable to challenge Chinese misbehaviour and disrespect for the rule of law and democracy.

It is important, therefore, as part of this motion, to recognise that we need to start to move back and diversify our trade relationship in Asia, but particularly in relation to China, so that we are not caught, for example, if the next US presidential election results in a change in our ability to export chips to China or vice versa. That could really compromise our economy in other ways. From an economic standpoint, which I acknowledge is a purely selfish one, we need to make sure we diversify our trade relationship with China and insulate ourselves from the risks that come with that, from the point of view of protecting this country.

My colleagues will talk about dairy and beef exports to China, which are hugely important to communities here. We need to safeguard those. If we truly respect China and the Chinese people, we also have to be willing to speak truth to them. This motion mentions a number of issues that are of global importance in terms of China treating its citizens in a way that we cannot possibly support or countenance.

There is a spectrum of misbehaviour and disrespect on the part of the Chinese Communist Party for its citizens. It ranges from the appalling genocide of the Uyghur people in Xinjiang, about which there can be no doubt. This is not merely speculation. The Chinese will tell us that it is and that they have alternative reports that tell us that it is not happening. In spite of the countless international reports, including by Michelle Bachelet and the UN, which have established as a matter of fact that there is a genocide happening there, they say that it is not happening but we know that it is. There is a real problem from Ireland's point of view in not calling that out and making sure we say it.A constituent of mine, Richard O'Halloran, was essentially imprisoned in China. I know, having worked with Deputy Coveney, the Minister's predecessor, the work he did with Wang Yi the Foreign Minister, to get that man back. It was difficult and painstaking.

The difficulty is that the Chinese at a governmental level simply do not respect the norms that every other respectable member of the international community stands up to. On one end we have the Uighurs, but we can then go through the trial of Jimmy Lai, a man represented by an Irish citizen, Caoilfhionn Gallagher, a friend of mine who is doing incredible work as a barrister to defend him. She is swimming against the tide, however, because the national security law in Hong Kong and disrespect for the rule of law means that the Chinese government has not only trumped up a charge against him and fabricated a trial, but has also coerced testimony from people like Andy Li who worked with Senator Byrne and me in the context of the Inter-Parliamentary Alliance on China, IPAC. He was tortured to give testimony against Jimmy Lai. That is what we are dealing with. The problem is that we as a country need to make sure that we communicate to China how reprehensible and unacceptable that is.

The third thing mentioned in the motion is Taiwan. We are not a military power; we are militarily non-aligned and so it should be. Politically, we must support Taiwan, Lai Ching-te and the new government of the Democratic Progressive Party, which was re-elected in recent weeks despite the greatest attempt at interference from Beijing. We must send out that message very clearly to Taiwan that we support it.

At the heart of the motion is a recognition that there are massive problems in our relationship with China because China refuses to play by the rules and to acknowledge the international rule of law and the human rights of its citizens. We have a trade surplus and have to safeguard our population and economic interests in China, but we must also speak truth to power and make sure that China hears Ireland does not abide by that and that we will not tolerate that in the long term.