Lisa Chambers (Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

With regard to the strategic plan, I note that this section lays down a process by which the plan is developed, how it is laid before the Houses and how it is consulted upon, and I have a couple of questions on that. I agree with the timeline set down. It should be done within six months and it is then submitted to the Minister and the Garda for the period of three years, which is a reasonable amount of time and allows for change when it is required.

Subsection (3) states:

“A strategic plan shall...

(b) specify in relation to the period to which the plan relates- (i) the main objectives ... of An Garda Síochána”.

I ask the Minister to elaborate further on how those objectives will be established, how they will be put together and how they will be set down in the plan. The section also refers to the strategies that will be pursued in order to achieve the main objectives and how those objectives will be measured.

There is quite a lot in that. I appreciate that not all of the detail will be contained within the legislation but, again, it goes back to earlier comments around having a policing plan for an area, acknowledging that the nature of policing has changed to such an extent, particularly in the last few months, when things have moved a lot. It is probably since the Covid period that policing has changed to a certain extent, as well as the relationship that the public have with gardaí, and there are the different challenges that we now face as a country in terms of the far-right, criminality and retail issues. Those issues will feed into how we set down the objectives of An Garda Síochána and what type of strategy it will pursue in achieving those objectives.

This is very important. The section goes on to state: “The Garda Commissioner shall, before preparing a strategic plan, consult with such persons as he or she considers appropriate.” Again, there is the question around who the Garda Commissioner will consult with. Is there a defined list of stakeholders that must be consulted with? Is there any flexibility around who he or she may consult with? If the Garda Commissioner were to consult with certain organisations, is there any opportunity for objections to be raised?There are a lot of organisations and NGOs out there that all have different views, agendas and whatnot in terms of that consultation process. On the face of this legislation, it looks as though the Garda Commissioner alone can decide who to consult with. I am wondering if there is a set list of persons or organisations that he or she must consult with. Is there an opportunity for local elected representatives, Oireachtas Members and members of the public to feed into how that strategic plan will be developed and who will be consulted with? In terms of the strategies to the pursued, that will be crucial. As I have said, there is not concern, because that is the wrong word, but an acknowledgment that policing has changed and there is a need for a different approach in some circumstances - not all. I do not think we should throw out the baby with the bathwater, for want for a better phrase. Some of the things that are done and some of the strategies employed by the Garda are very good and do not require change, but where change is needed, we must pursue strategies for the right reasons to ensure that they are not reactionary or emotionally-driven. We must ensure that they are done on the basis of evidence and research, and because they are the right thing to do. That consultation process will be key. Who are we talking to? As Senator Fitzpatrick asked in respect of another section, will there be scope to engage with the public, the people on the ground and the people who are actually engaging with front-line services in communities? It will be important to ensure that they have an opportunity to engage with this plan.

Section 63(3)(b)(iii) refers to "the outcomes by which the achievement of the main objectives may be measured". How to we intend to measure the achievement of those objectives? What happens if an objective is not achieved, the measurement is not favourable or the result is not what we want it to be? What is the process in terms of admitting we have not reached the objectives or achieved what we wanted to do? Will time be granted for more work to be done in achieving those objectives? Will sanctions be applied? Will there be disciplinary processes involved in that?

There is quite a lot in the section. I think the strategic plan prepared by the Commissioner is hugely important in terms of policing in the State. A one-size-fits-all approach will not work. Taking, for example, a rural community in County Mayo where I live and comparing it to inner city Dublin, the two are quite different in terms of their challenges and needs and the plan that would be appropriate in those areas. It will be really important to get a guarantee and an assurance that plans that are put in place will take into account the variation and differences across communities, whether they are rural communities or rural-urban communities, including smaller towns in rural areas like Castlebar where I live, and that they will be tailored to meet the needs of those communities, the policing force and An Garda Síochána in those communities.

As I have said previously, there are concerns around the allocation of resources in terms of meeting those objectives. We talk about the main objectives of An Garda Síochána and the strategies employed to achieve those objectives, and measuring how we have done on those objectives. If we have certain objectives for inner city Dublin, it may require certain things to be done on an annual basis that require a certain amount of resources. There are concerns being raised in the area where I live, in my community and in Mayo - not just in Castlebar but across the county - that resources are being funnelled into more challenging areas. If it is set down in legislation that objectives must be set out and achieved, and that they will be measured, there is an extra incentive for certain areas to look for extra resources to achieve their objectives. Where will those resources come from? Is there any cause for concern for those rural areas that, for the most part, are very quiet and have very few incidents of crime? That is not to say that issues do not occur in those areas. We still need a presence of An Garda Síochána in those areas. The concern that has been raised with me in my own area is that we could see resources being pulled from smaller rural areas into bigger towns and cities to the detriment of policing services in rural areas. When it is set out in legislation that objectives will be measured and looked at, it could create a situation where there is an extra incentive to pull resources from less challenging areas, if I can put it that way, into areas where there might be a greater challenge. What happens when something is required in a rural area? I mentioned the area of Achill in County Mayo yesterday, where for the most part there is quite a small population, but where there are peaks throughout the year when there is a huge increase in population, particularly over Christmas and during the summer and the tourism season. We need to have a strategic plan that accounts for that. Senior Garda management in the different areas have told me and other public representatives that there are no extra resources provided for those areas during those times when it is busier and there is an increased population. It is important, when we are setting out the main objectives of An Garda Síochána, that it is stated that there will be a tailored policing plan to meet the needs of rural and urban areas, that it is tailored to meet local needs and wants, and that where there is a significant change in the make-up of a community during a particular period of time, that will be catered for as well. That is done more on an ad hocbasis. Generally, it seems to be done through overtime in those areas. It needs to be set out in a strategic plan that resources will be made available to an area where there is an increase in population. I am thinking mainly along the west coast, where there are tourism areas where the population can more than double in during the summer. There are no extra resources and no plans to deal with the influx of visitors coming into the areas. They are really welcome and we want the visitors to keep coming, but the strategic plan needs to reflect changes, even throughout the year, in terms of the demands and needs in particular communities. The guards at home tell me that there really is no provision for that. They make do and make resources available if and when they are needed, through the use of overtime.

I ask the Minister to flesh out a bit on that section in terms of how the main objectives will be set out, who will feed into them, and how the strategies will be developed in terms of pursuing those main objectives. Where a measurement is taken and objectives have not been achieved, what is the follow-on from that? If there is a fear among local Garda management that they will be reprimanded or somehow sanctioned for not meeting objectives, it will only further fuel the issue around pulling resources from different areas to meet demands where there is pressure. We do not want to have gardaí competing internally for the allocation of resources. That is not where we want to be.

I am not against setting objectives and measuring performance. That is a good thing to do in any organisation, and I am sure the gardaí are very happy to have that. However, it becomes a challenge where are constraints on resources, which, of course, we are dealing with. We are seeing lots more gardaí coming into the force and Templemore is getting lots more recruits through. That is good, but where there are constraints on resources that will take a period time to address, something of that nature could lead to resources being pulled from other areas to try to meet objectives. I am keen to hear what happens when objectives are measured and are not met. Will time be granted to bridge that gap? I also ask the Minister to comment on section 63(4), according to which "The Garda Commissioner shall, before preparing a strategic plan, consult with such persons as he or she considers appropriate", and detail who that might be. I note that is dealt with somewhat in subsection (5), which states that the Garda Commissioner shall have regard to "the views of such persons as may be consulted..." The policies of the Government or any Minister will also be fed into that as well.