Rónán Mullen (Independent) | Oireachtas source

They have moved from scoring points to scoring own goals at this point. I thank the Minister for attending this debate and for agreeing that it is an important and timely debate. I also want to thank my colleagues Senators Keogan, Byrne, Carrigy, Warfield, Sherlock, Craughwell and McDowell for contributing. Thankfully, we do not use terminology like "top talent" here in the Seanad. We are all the same, and that is why we like each other so much.

I welcome the Minister's considered response to the Bill. However, now is the time to see this through, and this Bill should pass on Second Stage. There will be time, as we face on to Committee Stage, to take on board the work of the Minister's reviews. I congratulate her on her speedy action in bringing these reviews about, but my concern is that those reviews would only deliver on structure and finances, though I note her consideration of the issue of the salary cap in her contribution.

As I said earlier, this Bill is about limitation of salary, but it is also about transparency and accountability. I would ask the Minister to consider again the position where she said quite clearly that it was really a matter for the broadcaster to be accountable where there are breaches of the codes, but not for the individuals. That is part of the problem here. We have seen a culture develop where people saw themselves as people apart, and some of them still do. That is part of the problem, and part of the mentality that has led to excessive pay. It is no unusual thing for an employer to have sanctions where employees breach the terms of their contract. What my Bill proposes is that it would be a contractual requirement that people keeps their personal views out of their coverage, not just of news and current affairs, but content generally. That does not have a chilling effect, and I have been strong in recent times on the dangers of having a chilling effect on free expression. That just prevents people from using a privileged position to seek to influence the nation in the course of doing their job, when their job is not to seek to influence the nation, but to bring content people in a way that reflects all, represents, and brings forward all values in the community.

We need to be clear that it is part of the problem if individuals feel they can speak with impunity, because it is only their broadcaster that will be responsible if they, on their big salaries, abuse the public by imposing their views. That is why there is an accountability dimension of the issue that ought to be considered again, in conjunction with the salary cap and transparency issues have mentioned. My Bill does not propose to name and shame individuals against whom sanctions might apply within the organisation, where the compliance committee finds that there has been a breach; rather, the Bill requires the organisation to set out the sanctions that they can apply, including a possible public apology, in which case that would be known to the public, but not necessarily the other sanctions that might apply in that situation.

I was very taken by Senator Warfield's reference, and he captured it when he talked about the need to rebalance from personalities to public service. Senator McDowell also pointed out the "Upstairs Downstairs" culture that has applied, and has been so damaging to morale and, I dare say, to productivity in RTÉ, to some extent. Just as I defend the right of an individual to seek better terms and conditions - and I do, as I have condemned no person here today in my contributions - I also defend the right and the duty of an employer to hold its staff to account. The employer, in this case, has a duty to us, and the public, which it clearly has not met, but it also has a duty to hold its staff to account in the way that their job is done that does not have a chilling effect on anybody's doing of their job, or the proper presentation of current affairs or news. In fact, it would enhance it, by ensuring greater impartiality and objectivity.

I would like to make one last point. I think it was Senator Carrigy who talked about the media charge. I would have to say, "No, no, no", if there is any risk that it would lead us to less accountability. That could only ever be contemplated where there was a clear division between what is authentic and genuine public service content, well separate from the entertainment industry and other elements of the RTÉ product. Many people already bridle at having to pay a television licence fee, and often choose not to because they do not feel that they are getting the same respect as other citizens in the country.We cannot load another compulsory tax onto people unless there is serious reform. There is a need for fresh thinking among all of us as individuals, within the Government and within the public service broadcaster about what public service broadcasting is and how it can be made excellent so that it serves the people properly. I do not accept the amendment that we delay the passage of the Bill on Second Stage by 12 months. We should get on with it now. I thank the Minister for her response today.