Roderic O'Gorman (Dublin West, Green Party) | Oireachtas source

I thank all Senators for their contributions. It was a useful opportunity to discuss some of these issues, and to raise and address some of the misconceptions or disagreements that permeate through the Government and State response to the unprecedented crisis we face. I will take it from the start with the numbers and our State's ability to meet the needs of a significant number of arrivals, both from Ukraine and within international protection. I do not doubt for a minute, and neither does the Government, that the State has been pushed. There is pressure here and it is not easy when there is a very large and sudden increase in your country's population. It is not easy, but that is the consequence of a war. It is the consequence of a war in Europe the like of which we have not seen in Europe in any of our lifetimes. There is a question about what the State does in that situation, and how it responds. Does it say "No", does it say it is not going to reach out, or does it step up and do its thing? I think we have done that. It has been hard.

When one looks around Europe, it is obvious that not everyone has stepped up to the same extent, but others have stepped up further. There are countries that have taken in millions of people. It might be said that some of them have a bigger land mass or a bigger population, but none of them are as wealthy as our country. We have to recognise that Poland has taken in 1.4 million people and 7 million people have passed through the country. It is a far poorer country than this one. Hungary has taken about 900,000 people. Romania and Moldova, a country which is not even in the European Union, have taken greater numbers than we have. It is not a competition or a numbers game, but we have to realise that because of where our country stands now in terms of GDP, GNI* or whatever metric we want to use, we are a wealthy country. I believe we are able to stretch ourselves, although I recognise it is a stretch. That feeds into the issue of pressure on housing across the country.

Since the first day we addressed this issue in both Houses of the Oireachtas I have always recognised that our response is in the context of a housing crisis which means we are not able to provide everybody who needs one with a forever home. However, it is important to say that the Government has designed our response to the needs of Ukrainians and the needs of international protection in a way that means no one seeking housing in Ireland is disadvantaged in terms of their position on a housing list. Like myself, many people here started their careers on councils as councillors. We know the pressure local authorities are under to provide social housing, and how long many families and individuals have waited on a social housing list. In my own county of Fingal, some people have been waiting for ten, 11 or 12 years. International protection applicants do not get access to the social housing list. International protection applicants do not get access to housing assistance payment, HAP. Ukrainians do not get access to the social housing list or to HAP. They are accommodated in other forms. They are accommodated in hotels, guest houses, converted offices and modular homes. Unfortunately some international protection applicants are currently accommodated in tents, and some are not accommodated at all. For me, the worst thing is that we are not able to accommodate everybody, even in the limited accommodation system we have created for Ukrainians and international protection applicants. It is really important, and Senators have rightly focused on that point, that we are providing a basic level of accommodation for international protection applicants and for Ukrainians in this country.

We have had some useful discussion on what it is to be an international protection applicant.Senator Keogan used the term "asylum seeker". I use the term "international protection applicant" because it is the official term and I try to stick with that. It is important to note that everyone who seeks international protection has a right to have their application assessed. I would agree with what Senator Ward said. Not everybody will be successful. There will be adjudications that say a person does not meet the criteria for international protection. Unfortunately I do not have the section of the Act here to read it out but it is important to say that international protection is not only given to people who are fleeing a war-torn situation. Many people in the process are fleeing war-torn situations but it can also be where people can prove that they risk persecution because of situations unique to them, which are listed. It could be because someone is LGBT+ in a country where that is not accepted. It could be because someone is a woman, a feminist activist in a country where that is not accepted. It could be on religious grounds or on a range of other grounds. If an individual's situation meets the criteria, then he or she is entitled to international protection. We do not say that people from one country cannot get access to international protection.

Senator Keogan mentioned inaccurate and incorrect documents. That is an issue that has been raised. It is fair to raise it but it is also fair to put it into context. We in Ireland are used to being able to leave our country freely. We have a right to a passport. We have a right to travel outside of our country. It is not the same in every country. There are many countries where people's ability to leave the country is absolutely dependent on the government of the day giving them an exit visa. For a feminist activist in Iran right now, or someone who is LGBT+ in Afghanistan, it is very likely that the regimes there see them as an enemy. If they are looking to flee their country, the only actual way is to use fake documents. It is genuinely hard for us to assess that because we live in a country where it is not even an issue. It is a reality of flight. It is a reality of persecution that people have to use such documents in some circumstances.