Gerry Horkan (Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I thank Senator McDowell and his group are tabling the motion and the Minister of State for his response. I thought it was useful that we would have the response of the Minister of State and the Department to Senator McDowell's very clear and damning acknowledgement of what is happening in this part of western China. I certainly do not doubt the findings of what is going on. There are far too many people involved from different organisations, including the United Nations and the Uyghur Tribunal.

I take the point from the diplomatic service, the Minister of State and the Department on where we draw the line on accepting a report from a body that is not officially internationally recognised as such. However, I do not doubt for a minute anything Senator McDowell has said. What he has brought to the Chamber has done a service and not only to us in understanding what is going on. I have to say I would be fairly sure an awful lot of people in Ireland do not know the level of activity and oppression going on in this part of the world. Unfortunately, I know more about it now than I did before. It is absolutely horrific to imagine that this type of behaviour is going on unfettered. It is not the only thing the Chinese authorities seem to be doing. We know of its relationship with Hong Kong, Taiwan, Tibet, the Falun Dafa and even Christians. It has a particular style and approach that we would not tolerate or expect and we should not allow this House or any other House to say any of that activity is okay.

I would much prefer if the Department had felt it could have accepted what Senator McDowell had said. This is my opinion. I understand there are protocols in place and Government formats that need to be adhered to from its perspective. We have a relationship with China and we need to understand that relationship. The Chinese also need to realise we are not okay with what is happening in this part of China. We are not okay with the relationship with Taiwan. We are not okay with what is happening in Hong Kong and the guarantees it gave and has continually eroded since.

I was asked to speak on the motion on behalf of our spokesperson on foreign affairs who is not available. I do not pretend to be an expert on the Uyghur people or the region in China they are from. I take on board what Senator McDowell is saying and I am sure Senator Mullen will say something similar. I ask them not to take it personally. I am here as a person representing the Government group. It would have been much easier for me if the amendment had not had to be tabled but that was what the Government felt was necessary and sometimes this happens.As a former Attorney General, Tánaiste and Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, Senator McDowell knows that protocols must sometimes be followed and that things less than palatable must be taken as compromises. This amendment is trying to bring as much of Senator Mullen's motion on board as possible. It is acknowledges "That Seanad Éireann notes the publication of the judgement of the Uyghur Tribunal on 9th December, 2021" and:

further notes:

- continued deep concern in relation to evidence-based reports on the treatment of the Uyghur people in Xinjiang;

calls on:

- China to allow immediate, meaningful and unfettered access to Xinjiang for independent observers, including the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights and her Office, and relevant special procedure mandate holders;

We should not just be calling for that, we should be insisting on it, particularly in light of our seat on the UN Security Council. The amendment then urges "the immediate implementation of the Committee on the Elimination of Racial Discrimination’s eight recommendations related to Xinjiang".

We are not dismissing the motion and we are certainly not saying that it does not have merit. The Senator has done an enormous service by bringing it forward in this Chamber in order to allow us to have this debate. He can probably tell from the sizeable number of people here that not many are going to try to defend the indefensible. I cannot speak for all the Government Senators, but I know that nobody is going to defend the Chinese Communist Party regime's behaviour in this regard, nor in any other.

Many Government Senators, including Senators Malcolm Byrne, Ward, Joe O’Reilly, myself and others, have criticised these things in the past. It is unfortunate that the Government amendment to the motion had to be tabled, but I understand why that had to happen. There are other relationships at play here. We all understand the difficulties recently experienced in the context of the case of Richard O’Halloran. Indeed, the case might not have turned out as it did. It was a horrific incident, but, thankfully, the conclusion arrived at was better than the alternative, which could still exist for others.

I appeal from this side of the House to the Chinese regime, not that it is necessarily going to listen to the Seanad r the Irish people, but it should acknowledge that there is worldwide concern and deep concern-----