Pauline O'Reilly (Green Party) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the Minister of State to the House, although she is no stranger to the convention centre. This boils down to a stranglehold the Catholic Church has had on Irish society. It is important to point out those who have been heckling others today, defending the Catholic Church and saying the Catholic Church has a right to be involved in healthcare are anti-choice. That is the concern we have. I am not a religious person. I am not Catholic. I have a right to go into a State hospital and have the kind of care I want and am legally entitled to in this country.

Someone else has a right to go into a church and pray. He or she has religious freedom. The whole point of this is the Government is in a difficult position and successive Governments have probably been in a difficult position, because our schools and hospitals have been under religious control for so long it is part of the legal basis upon which they are founded. To move from that into something else, which is completely State-owned, is difficult. It has taken eight years to get to this point.

I am also concerned by what the Mulvey agreement says in that the religious order shall not have undue influence. The term "undue influence" is the concern. It should not have any influence. Senator Conway pointed that out. The agreement which is the basis for this hospital is the concern. I am not convinced it is as straightforward as some people are pointing out to move into a different situation. I know the Minister and the Government are trying all they can and there are ongoing negotiations. What we really want is to be assured every avenue is being chased up, because the land should absolutely be in State ownership.

Most of us - not all - would say the land should be in State ownership. How we get to that point is the problem. How do we get to the point of moving the 90% of our schools which are also owned by the Catholic Church in one way or another, whether through another company or not, over into State ownership?It is not an easy task. I do not have all the answers but most of us are on the same page and know what we want to happen. I have brought forward motions about contraceptives and worked for a long time on repealing the eighth amendment. Most of us are coming at this with the best of intentions, the Minister of State included, though we might disagree on different things. I would love to hear from her what steps are being taken to ensure we can move not just this hospital but Irish society into a different place. We are quite entitled to feel we have been let down by the Catholic church for generations because we have been. All those who are contacting us are quite right to be concerned but we also need to make sure the hospital is built because these negotiations have been going on for eight years too long and there is still not any groundwork done on that site.

I thank the Minister of State for listening to me. I wish I had all the answers but I do not. I just know we need a hospital built. It should be on State land and now we need to get to that point through some form of negotiation, unfortunately. My concern about using a CPO is that it could take the same length of time again. If the church was to do the decent thing and earn back the respect of the women of this country, which it has lost, then it would gift the land to the State. People within the Catholic church might like to think about what kind of pressure they can put on their own church in that regard.