Lorraine Clifford-Lee (Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the Minister of State, Deputy Butler, and thank her for outlining the Government's position.

I come to this debate as somebody who has a keen interest in women's healthcare and reproductive health and rights. I campaigned for a long number of years to repeal the eighth amendment with many Senators here in this Chamber, and beyond with civil society groups. We have a very complex history here in this country about how we treat women, in particular, in relation to their reproductive health, well-being and care. I suppose we are looking at this in light of the referendum, the mother and baby homes report and that deep trauma that is still there in Irish society for women. I suppose people are terrified. There is a great fear. They do not trust the assurances of independence. That is the hill we have to climb here with this. It is incumbent on all of us here to work together. We should not stoke up fear and anxiety, because there is already enough of that out there, but we should work constructively to solve this issue.

There are two main issues here: the ownership issue and the ethos issue. There are ways that we can come around both of these. My big fear is that the current National Maternity Hospital is not fit for purpose. In terms of the facility, the women of Dublin deserve better than what we have currently. I am not talking about the clinical oversight there or the excellent care they get. They deserve state-of-the-art co-located facilities. That is international best practice.

I would be fearful that this is used as a battering ram and as something to make a point on, and who will lose out only the women of Ireland again? That is my main concern - that we do not go off down some mad tangent path and the women do not get the hospital that they need desperately and deserve.

The compulsory purchase order, CPO, issue has been mentioned. I would be fearful if we go down that path that this hospital would never get built.

There are substantial fears around the ownership and the ethos but we can come around those. On the leasehold of 149 years, many have been fed the line that we will not own the land and we will not own the hospital. We will own the building on it and leasehold is a substantial form of ownership. Many houses and apartments, certainly in Dublin, are held in leasehold. There is no issue with the ownership of that. You can get bulletproof long leases there and it isde factoownership.

That issue leads into the ethos issue. I am mindful of the battles that we have all undertaken in the past number of years. I am a proud feminist. I am somebody who has worked very hard to ensure reproductive health rights are provided for every women and girl in this country.

The assurances of independence are not trusted but these issues can be overcome if we come together and work in a substantial fashion to make sure that the independence of the hospital is maintained, the golden share is bulletproof, and no Canon Law is attached to anything within the structure of the trust or within the hospital board itself. The Minister, Deputy Stephen Donnelly, understands these issues, is on board with many of the fears here and will not railroad the State into a massive investment where the lads from Rome will come and start imposing some sort of Canon Law on our hospital. That will not happen.

I have seen many posters stating, "Take your rosaries off my ovaries." The nuns are gone as well. The nuns do not want to have anything to do with this hospital. I understand that deep fear but we have a complex system of voluntary hospitals, State hospitals and privately owned hospitals in this country. I strongly believe we need to start unravelling that system but that unravelling will take a long time and I do not want the women of Ireland to fall victim to this and for their healthcare needs to be put on the back burner while we undertake that project.

Let us build this hospital. Let us get the guarantees we need. Let us do everything to make this as bulletproof as possible. Let us accept the bona fides here of the St. Vincent's Hospital Group and the religious orders here.

The religious orders have done an awful lot of good in this country as well. I was educated by the Mercy nuns in Waterford city. They educated generations of working-class women and give us the start in life that we would not have got elsewhere.

I just want to make sure that we get this hospital built and that everybody is brought into the process and given the assurances that they need.