Alice-Mary Higgins (Independent) | Oireachtas source

I move amendment No. 5:

In page 13, line 31, to delete “and the Tribunal agrees that it would be appropriate to do so,”.

The Minister and others have spoken very eloquently in this House and elsewhere about the contribution made by many of the women affected by the CervicalCheck scandal. It has had very deep and personal effects on their lives, in some cases causing the loss of their lives. Many of these women have raised their voices in a very positive way to highlight the importance of the human papillomavirus, HPV, vaccine and to talk about screening and the reality of CervicalCheck and how it affects them and their families. It was mentioned earlier that at each stage of this process individual women have continually pushed for standards to be raised. They have demanded more and they have been very clear that we need a new culture now. This was echoed in Dr. Scally's report. We need to move past the culture of silence and circling the wagons. We need to move to a health system in which women's voices and experiences are heard and recognised. That must carry through to this tribunal in its adjudicatory function.

In that context I have a very serious concern about section 20 of this Bill. As the Minister said, we are attempting to do something new here, but some old language has reappeared. Section 20 includes the phrase "Hearings generally to be otherwise than in public". This means that these are again to be private hearings. That will be the norm except where a claimant requests for the tribunal to hold a hearing or part of a hearing in public and the tribunal agrees that it would be appropriate to do so.

Here is my concern. If a woman wishes to have her hearing in public she should have it in public.There are exceptions which have been mentioned in correspondence from the Department regarding a single sentence but that is not the issue. If part of the way through a process, a woman may feel she wants to switch to a public process because of how she is experiencing it and because of the fear many women have of the very adversarial relationship the State has sometimes had with them. As such, this is something that gives that assurance that they will be able to have their hearings in public or to move to a public hearing if they so wish. That is vital. The language, unfortunately, of the section as drafted echoes directly the language we saw in relation to the mother and baby homes commission which said specifically that evidence would be received in private except where a witness requests to give evidence in public and the commission grants that request. We have the exact same dynamic. We know the reality in relation to mother and baby homes was that many requested to have their evidence heard in public and had that request was denied. We have in our past experience a situation in which women have felt further silenced, even in the arenas in which they should have got justice, and were denied the right to have their voices heard. The Minister will understand people's concerns. We talk about restoration of trust and I recognise the Minister is trying to engage in that process. However, it is a major project and we have very real issues with trust in the State. One of the things that is important is that sense of openness.

My amendment suggests simply that where a claimant requests the tribunal to hold a hearing, or part of a hearing in public, the tribunal shall conduct the hearing, or part of the hearing, in public. It seeks to remove the fear that the tribunal will simply determine that. The Bill includes no measures as to how the tribunal would determine that. There is nothing in the Bill about what the tribunal would consider to be appropriate. There is no caveat and no mechanism to appeal. The Minister might give me an initial response as to how he thinks this can be addressed. Can he accept my amendment today or consider it for the next Stage? How can the Minister assure the House that we will not have a situation in which women are silenced in this process?