John Paul Phelan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

Perhaps Listowel is a bit big, but in the town out of which I operate, Thomastown, in Kilkenny, there used to be a number of drapery shops until quite recently. Now there is one left, and the sad reality is that they are not coming back because people my age and younger than me buy their clothes for the most part online. How can we develop a funding stream for local government on the basis of this, or how do we adjust what is there? No amount of pious words from me or wishful thinking will bring back old businesses. Three branches of my family ran rural post offices, one in south Wexford and two in south Kilkenny. They are gone now. At least one of them was in a big village. People no longer use the services in the numbers they did.

This brings me to Senator Lombard's question about rates. We had hoped before the end of the year to have a commercial rates consolidation Bill tabled. We did not get to it but we will do it in the spring. This will give the municipal district councillors - not just the county councillors, as is currently the case - the power to strike a rate in each county, vary that rate and target it for perhaps a specific town or village or the main street in every village in the municipal district. Crucially, it will also give them the power to ask a multiple that has opened on the edge of the town or big village to pay a higher commercial rate. In effect, then, one would ensure that some of the crucifying elements of commercial rates on older established businesses that have tiny turnover but keep a service provided in a smaller town can be mitigated. This can be offset against the big multiples that are making large profits out of these rural towns but have had a huge effect on the main streets of the towns. It is easier for people to use them because they usually have free parking on the edge of the town. This variation will be in the rates Bill. I am not sure whether that addresses Senator Lombard's concerns about municipal councillors.I emphasise to the Senator that section 24 was changed by me on Committee Stage in the Dáil following the Second Stage speeches of Cork representatives. The county council was anxious that a provision be inserted to allow a review of the financial settlement before the ten-year period elapsed. We took it out to provide a ten-year horizon of certainty. There is an assumption on the part of many that after ten years the compensation will automatically and necessarily disappear. It will be a matter for whoever is in my role in ten years, following a submission by the city council that the county council will be able to respond to. It will be able to argue that commercial rates have been lost, which could affect the likes of Ringaskiddy and Little Island, as mentioned by Senator Burke.

I was hopeful about the review process and I was equally surprised at where some of the lines appeared. I was quite happy that Little Island was excluded, not just on the basis of commercial rates. Coming from Waterford's direction, it is the bit going into Cork that I know. I would still regard what goes up to the Dunkettle roundabout as part of the county. Others might disagree with that. There is a mechanism for the ten-year review and it is not cut and dried that the process will all be in one direction. It will require both councils to make the case as to why it should stay the same or become something different. It will be up to the Minister of the day to make the decision.