Victor Boyhan (Independent) | Oireachtas source

I was elected in 1999 to local government, as was the Minister of State, so we go back a long way. We have had many a debate about local government. I pulled out that very famous document today, Putting People First. It is still the backbone of local government reform although it has been chopped and changed. It is funny that the Minister of State shares a constituency with one of the great architects of much of it, although Mr. Hogan has moved to richer pastures in Europe.

I took the time to read over the Dáil Committee Stage debate on this Bill. Some 128 amendments were submitted on Committee Stage, of which 27 were tabled by Members of the Opposition while the remainder were proposed by the Minister. Deputies Grealish, Ó Cuív and Connolly, all from Galway, were strongly opposed to the inclusion of Galway in the Bill. I want to concentrate on Galway first. Senator Buttimer is very well known in Cork and is on the ground there much more than I would be, so he will deal with that. I undertook to write to all Galway representatives and came across no councillor who was in favour of this. There were two or three maybes but they did not flesh it out. I sent them the documentation, the memorandum and a whole load of things to engage with them to find out their understanding and knowledge of this proposal. I would rate Deputies Grealish, Connolly and Ó Cuív very highly. They are very different and represent different segments of their constituency. I have to listen to what they have to say. I then went on a bit further to consider Galway. The Minister of State has said some new things tonight, which I acknowledge. He might clarify that he would see two chambers, be it Galway County Council and Galway City Council. It is a great honour to be a member or chairman. I know a lot of people who have served as mayor of Galway city. It is a position held by few and greatly guarded and respected in Galway. If I was a councillor in the city, I would have loved the opportunity to be mayor. They are exceptionally proud of the city and rightly so. We have to understand where they are coming from. However, I am hearing other stories.

What sort of engagement has the Minister of State had with the County and City Management Association, CCMA? It is effectively a trade union although its members might not like to hear me say that. It represents the interests of city and county managers. I am not too sure it would be particularly pleased. I am not here to advocate for it because I have had concerns about it in the past. However, on the whole, city and county managers do an exceptionally good job. There are shortcomings, and I also see shortcomings in the Bill. The Minister of State is talking about mayors being directly elected. I think this is all a bit too fast. We need to hold back. The Minister of State made reference to three different independent review groups. I have read all three reviews. All of them without exception say that unless we address the financial structures and rate base of these local authorities, and the baseline funding, we cannot proceed. That is really important. The Bill, however, does not address it. We need to go back and look at the whole issue of public administration and the good corporate governance structures that are lacking in many local authorities. They are the issues we need to address and they are not in the Bill. How are we going to fund these councils? The Minister of State says the special fund is going to assist Galway County Council in its budget. It was a bit premature of them to be counting their chickens before they hatched. The Minister of State wants to unite those two local authorities but I have concerns. I would draw his attention to two counties he will know well, Carlow and Laois. They are small counties with distinct, independent county councils that have a lot of shared services. We have the CCMA shared services initiative. I think the Government should be looking more at that approach.How can the retention of local authorities be allowed for? It should not be forgotten that Limerick city and county councils merged some years ago. Waterford City and County Council is another good example of shared synergies and greater co-operation. The Minister of State must examine this but understand why people do not want to let go. That is important. Accountability and good corporate governance in local authorities are the issues that must be addressed. What has he to say about the CCMA? Will he outline his engagement with AILG and LAMA? I ask him to again consider synergies such as those between Carlow and Laois, which work well.

It is important that citizens buy into this. I have no difficulty with a plebiscite. When there is a plebiscite, politicians will have to get off the fence and back the case either for or against a proposal on a plebiscite. That will be interesting because it will be a measure of their commitment and knowledge of the matter on the ground.

What about the Department's local property tax review? The Minister set up a review group and the review is still sitting on his desk. How is all this feeding into the process? How will he address the fact that some local authorities are subsidising others? How can the issue of the Galway councils having uncollected levies and funds owed by developers be addressed? Some of the developments were not built, but many of them were. The Minister of State or the staff in his Department will be aware that I have submitted numerous queries and questions about these uncollected funds and the fact that nearly every local authority is owed money. What is the Department doing about this? In the private sector they would be fired if they did not take in what they were due.

There are many complex issues surrounding this matter, and I am not too sure whether it is premature. I am not pushing out tomorrow but I ask the Minister of State to put a halt to this after tonight until the new year, consider his suggestions about greater communication and an all-day debate in the Seanad, which is a good one, and which I have no doubt but that the Leader will take up and follow, and let us see how we can address the issue. It is about good administration, governance and accountability.

I have kept the most important matter to last. Support cannot be secured across the political spectrum for the Bill - and I hope this will change - without getting local managers or directors, or chief executives, as we now call them, to appear before the Committee of Public Accounts and be held accountable and answerable for the money voted through the budget for the Local Government Fund, for which the Minister of State is responsible. He suggests we change the title from "chief executive" to "mayor". To whom are the powers being given and from whom are they being taken? The Minister of State knows local government well. I can guarantee him that the chief executives will not relinquish one ounce of power. He must, therefore, tell us whether he proposes to take powers from county councillors, chief executives or the big organisation known as the Custom House in Dublin. Someone must relinquish powers for others to gain them. This is premature. We have had a good hearing in this debate and we should revisit the matter in the new year.