John Paul Phelan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Senators who have contributed and will try to refer to as many of the issues they have raised as possible. To take the last issue first, I note that the formation of a commission will have no impact on Seanad reform legislation. Several Senators raised this matter. We have committed to the implementation of meaningful Seanad reform. As Senator Paddy Burke pointed out, a commission would have a role to play in future regarding what the register of electors for the Seanad elections will be. It will be a significant function.

Senator Davitt expressed his support and that of Fianna Fáil. Senator Boyhan spoke about when the RIA was due. The original intention was that it would be published at Hallowe'en and we remain on course for that target. We will not publish it in advance of the presidential election. It is important to keep things separate and to protect the integrity of the voting process that will be engaged in at the end of October. Immediately following that, however, it is our intention to publish.

Senator Boyhan and others also spoke about possible outside interference in elections. That is certainly a matter I envisage a commission having a role in in future. Senator Coffey referred to the modernisation of the register. In fact, every second Senator referred to that. Something always strikes me about election turnout. I was in a discussion this morning on local government in other parts of the world, in particular in Britain where local authorities have more functions. Whether they operate better is arguable but turnout for local elections in Britain is abysmal. Our turnout for local elections is quite good, however. The accuracy of the electoral register varies nationally.I think we could add on between 5% to 10% in turnout for most elections and referendums in this country fairly easily because of people who are incorrectly included or even excluded, as Senator Coffey said, from the register.

Senators Coffey and Paddy Burke and others mentioned the role of local authorities. The commission, as I envisage it, would be responsible for the electoral register. As for being on the ground, as Senator Burke said, rate collectors are a rarer breed now than they were, but it is interesting that in my local authority area, where the rate collectors are still on the ground, the register is more accurate. The commission will have an oversight role but the local authorities will still have a very important function.

There are other functions. Senators Warfield and Ruane referred to online voter registration, which exists in many other parts of the world. It is our intention, as I outlined in my opening comments, that, following the presidential election, that renewal process, which will take a number of years, will allow for online registration into the future and the elimination of the 23 forms that currently exist in favour of one standard form, as Senator Ruane said, be it in electronic or paper format. There are people who will still want the paper form. This matter is very much still on course and will be part of the commission's responsibility.

The single identifier is the issue when it comes to online registration, whether it be the PPS number or other options. There is still work to be done in this regard to decide what route we will take. We must avoid the duplications and exclusions of people and the inclusion on registers of people who are deceased. What is particularly prevalent in Dublin city is that there might be ten people on an electoral register at one address but some of them have not lived there for ten years. To avoid these kinds of situations in the future, there will need to be some kind of identifier.

Several Senators spoke about the need for this body to have teeth. It absolutely will, including some of the teeth that may reside with the Standards in Public Office Commission and the Referendum Commission, when it is established for referendums, along with additional teeth.

I emphasise what the two Senators at the back said - I am like a teacher now - Senators Higgins and Ruane, about being ambitious. I am very ambitious. I have wanted this myself for a long time and I see the merits in it. As someone who has observed elections all over the world in my anorak capacity - in another life, if you like - I see the benefits of this. It exists in many other countries. What happened with the electronic voting fiasco of 20 years ago was a kind of top-down "this is what we are going to do" approach, and the public rebelled against it, so we must protect the integrity of what we have. I think this will, as Senator Higgins said, mean that other functions and roles will be bolted onto the commission in the future but I assure the House that there will be no delay from the Government's perspective in getting the commission up and running. This is why there has been a renewed impetus in recent months.

Senator Humphreys expressed his support for the proposal and spoke about the first memo for Cabinet in 1996, which is a long time ago. He spoke about the removal of the Minister and the Department and he is right. This commission needs to be independent. Currently, the eight people who occupy the franchise section in the Department, who are exceptional civil servants, become the commission at election time, whether it is a referendum or an election. Many of their functions will be moved to the new electoral commission once it is established. As I think Senator Humphreys emphasised, there have never been any questions raised about the roles of the franchise section. They are the most dedicated bunch of civil servants I have ever dealt with. Like me, they are a little anoraky, so to speak, when it comes to elections.

Senator Grace O'Sullivan spoke about Ireland being something of a beacon of democracy in the current world and she is right. I agree with her fully. This is where some differences will emerge because there are so many issues for which people believe the commission should be responsible. Senator O'Sullivan said the commission should be responsible for boundary commissions. Ultimately, while I believe the Oireachtas must still retain responsibility for establishing the terms of reference for boundary commissions, the commission should receive the report and should be responsible for ensuring that the committee reviewing the boundaries is established and that it is independent and separate. We cannot, however, remove from the public, whom we represent, the responsibility for drawing up the terms of reference under which such boundary reviews operate.

Senator O'Sullivan said automatic registration is important. Again, this is part of the review of the registration process that will happen following the presidential election.

The Seanad reform group wants one person, one vote. I myself do, and I await any development in this regard with interest. I know Members here have contributed greatly to the workings of that committee over recent months. It was our intention at the start to have a report sometime around Hallowe'en, and I think that is still pretty much on target.

Senator Ó Donnghaile acknowledged the current impetus for the referendum on voting rights next May. The reason this referendum was mentioned is that it is specifically about registration and how registration in the future might need to change dramatically to facilitate people outside of the State. There has been no change in Government policy such that the referendum on the minimum voting age would be held at the same time.

I was here when the Taoiseach spoke in the Seanad about his interest and desire to see reform of the Seanad. This is one of the reasons it will happen.

Senator Ó Donnghaile also spoke about the allocation of the two MEP seats to the North of Ireland. The two seats were allocated on Monday to the Dublin and South constituencies. There is one thing that always strikes me. Yesterday we had a debate on town councils in the Dáil in which Deputies referred to the fact that people from certain towns are no longer the mayors of those areas. Anyone can stand for election anywhere in Ireland. We have had a fine tradition in this House and especially in the European Parliament of Northern Ireland representatives being elected in constituencies here. We cannot under the terms of the Belfast Agreement and so many other terms have a European Parliament constituency for Northern Ireland but we can have, have had and should have into the future Northern people elected here. Senators Ó Donnghaile and Coffey spoke about looking at the Electoral Commission in the North. That is very much part of our considerations.

Senator Warfield expressed disappointment that the website of the Department does not have information on directly elected mayors. I came here from a meeting of the Cabinet at which the matter of directly elected mayors was discussed. The Department gets blamed for many things, by me as well as others, but it cannot put up information that has not been agreed by the Government. I suspect that that information will be put up once the Cabinet minutes are done. Senator Warfield did, however, welcome the establishment of a commission. He urged that it have more resources. He spoke about online registration, CSO data and targeting demographics. He cited an interesting statistic that Ireland is 137th in the world on voter registration. I would like to know under whose measure that is the case. We have problems with voter registration, but 137th seems quite extraordinary.

Senator Ruane spoke at length of her support and the importance of fostering outreach and involvement. She is absolutely correct. We have, by international standards, high enough participation rates in elections but they vary a lot across the country. I see one of the key roles here being to tell people what their local councillors do. The Senator is right to make that point. Sara Moorhead, senior counsel, is conducting a review of the role of councillors and their remuneration. It is the first time anyone has ever looked at what councillors are doing, what we think they should be doing and whether they should have more functions. The education aspect the Senator talks about will be an important part of the commission. She spoke about compulsory voting. It works well, I am told, in Australia. I do not like compulsory anything myself. I like the idea of it but I still think people should have the option. Sometimes people choose not to vote for reasons that are legitimate or valid or whatever word one wants to use, and that is a protest in itself. I am not sure about compulsory voting.

Senators Ruane and Higgins spoke about limitations on postal voting. We have done a little work ourselves in this regard.There is more to be done on the categories of Irish people who are overseas who are currently entitled to vote. Diplomats are entitled to vote yet if one works for Enterprise Ireland in an embassy overseas, one is not entitled to vote, which is extraordinary. I hope we will be able to do something in the course of the next few months to extend it somewhat. The commission will have a role in that regard into the future.

Senator Paddy Burke spoke about councils and also about bringing the Bill into the Seanad first. I have no problem with that and think it would be the right thing to do. We would have more time to discuss it and have a less politically charged shouting match about what should and should not be in it.

Senator Higgins referred to the debate last December and spoke of the importance of establishing the commission. It might be a gradual process and that is why we are where we are.

I have already spoken about turnout. On the issue of postering in general, there are two very different frames of thought, with some people who think we should ban election posters, most of whom are incumbent politicians. We should at least look at what is done in large parts of the Continent and elsewhere, where there are places where posters should be located and places where they should not. This would also be fair in terms of cost because posters are costly and people with deep pockets can afford more than others. However, it is an inherent injustice to new candidates if they cannot put their face up and let people know who they are and what they are about. Nonetheless, the free-for-all that currently exists is an issue the commission should look at.

On another note of discord, which is the issue of who regulates posters, advertising and billboards, notwithstanding the recent referendum when some fairly horrific posters were erected, I have reservations about anyone deciding what can be put on a political poster other than the people putting it up. My reservations are connected with free speech but, in fact, I believe grotesque posters like that serve to damage the cause for which they are erected, as they did in the last referendum. They might not have done that in the past but I think people are more open nowadays than they have ever been and I do not think they accept things word for word. I have historic posters in the hall of my house. One is the old Cumann na nGaedheal one, "Keep the Red Off Our Flag", from the 1932 election. Another is "The Shadow of the Gunman" poster, which is another Cumann na nGaedheal poster. Those posters probably would not be allowed nowadays but they were in the 1920s and 1930s, when there were many gunmen around. Now, they are historic artefacts of a kind.

People are often the best judge. I would not be comfortable with deciding who would judge the content of what should go on posters, although the Advertising Standards Authority for Ireland has some role in ensuring they are not obscene and so on. If people go down that route ultimately, I believe it would be counterproductive to their electoral prospects in any case, but that is a job the commission should have. I look forward to it having that role. When we have the legislation, I will certainly endeavour to make sure it is in the Seanad first.