Gerard Craughwell (Independent) | Oireachtas source

This is the Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Flanagan's Bill. In 20 or 30 years' time nobody will ask who else was involved or what pressure was brought to bear to have this Bill put forward. It is the Minister's Bill and nobody else's. It is his party's Government, supported by the Independent Alliance, that is putting it through the House. Let us move away from the personalised issues that surround other Ministers who may or may not have influence on the Bill.

It is laudable to seek fair and transparent methodologies for appointing people to senior positions but I sometimes wonder about the drive to find independent committees and chairs. Senior military officers are now appointed by civilians who have never served in the field. Senior gardaí are appointed by civilians who never served on the ground. Now we will to try have judges appointed by committees whose members may or may not have some knowledge of the law and some of whom will have picked up their knowledge of the law from "Judge Judy" or some other television series.There is something terribly wrong with this Bill. My father, God be good to him, who was a great supporter of the Minister's father and the Minister's party, would turn in his grave to think that Fine Gael is prepared to use the Whip to drive through something the party fundamentally disagrees with. Members of the Minister's party have stood up in this House and criticised this Bill. Members of the Minister's party outside this House have criticised this Bill.

It is important, now that we have come forward with a Bill to appoint judges, that we see it through. As my colleague, Senator McFadden, just said, the Judiciary has served this country well, by and large. I have not always liked many of the decisions made. That is not the point. The members of the Judiciary have shown their independence. They have shown their ability to stand up when called upon to do so.

I am a little concerned as to where we are going. I am a little concerned about the reputation of this country. Paragraph 29 of the GRECO report that I have reads, "The Government states that it has engaged in in-depth formal consultation with the senior representatives of the judiciary on this draft legislation." That is a statement made by the Government to GRECO. The Government has engaged with senior representatives of the Judiciary on this draft legislation.

Paragraph 30 reads:

GRECO has also received information, directly submitted to it, by the judicial authorities, through the Chief Justice of Ireland, the President of the High Court and Acting President of the Court of Appeal, the President Designate of the Court of Appeal, the President of the Circuit Court and the President of the District Court concerning Recommendation vii. In their submission they stress that the Judicial Appointments Commission Bill 2017 has not been subject to in-depth consultations with the judiciary (contrary to what is stated by the Government).

This is one of the most serious statements made in this report. Somebody has lied to GRECO. The Minister told me here, on 3 July, that there was no earthquake. That is an earthquake as far as I am concerned. That is damning.

How can we proceed with this Bill, given that our most senior judges have said they were not consulted when the Government says they were? We need to know which judges were consulted. The Minister should name them, if he can, because the Chief Justice is one who is saying he was not and the presidents of every court state the Government did not talk to them. Will the Minister tell me who was spoken to?