Seanad debates

Wednesday, 2 May 2018

Prohibition of Conversion Therapies Bill 2018: Second Stage

 

10:30 am

Photo of Fintan WarfieldFintan Warfield (Sinn Fein) | Oireachtas source

I thank all the Senators who supported the debate. I should acknowledge that this is Government time, which is a reflection of the cross-party support for the Bill. Some 20 Senators are co-signatories, including Senators from Sinn Féin, Fine Gael, Fianna Fáil, the Labour Party, the Green Party and Independents. I should say that Senators John Dolan and Billy Lawless wished to co-sign the legislation but, due to unforeseen circumstances, it was not possible. I note their support for the Bill.

I thank Senator Ivana Bacik for her advice and support in the drafting of the legislation. I am hopeful that this debate will ensure the safe passage of the Bill through the Houses. I thank the Government for outlining that it will not oppose the Bill and accept entirely that there may be wording issues and that changes may be required. Sometimes when one sits on a piece of work for six or seven months, one just wants to let it go and allow the ten Stages within the Oireachtas to iron out the issues.

The legislative opinions were becoming almost contradictory or overwhelming. None of the 20 signatories who co-signed the legislation has waived his or her rights to amend the Bill on further Stages. The Bill represents the first attempt by these Houses and, by extension, the State to navigate our way through certain language such as "sexual orientation", "gender identity" and "gender expression". From my understanding, none of this language, even within gender recognition legislation, has been defined in legislation. We must all partake in that process of navigation and I am absolutely open to discussion with the Department on the direction of the Bill.

I concur with Senator Norris, who cited the Minister of State's assertion that we need to get an evidence base to establish the prevalence of conversion therapy. I mentioned in the Irish context that my heart was broken when, on Facebook, I heard a Brazilian the same age as me, who was recorded at Pentecostal church in this city, speaking about the process through which he rejected homosexuality. He was applauded and encouraged by the congregation and by the pastor at the altar. That Pentecostal church is about 500 m from my home and the Minister of State's constituency office. There is evidence that it is happening under our noses as well as elsewhere.

We also have to reflect on the experiences of LGBT people in our State mental health services. In my opening speech today, I cited a survey in the International Journal of Mental Health Nursing, whose respondents experienced the following: "An assumption that I was heterosexual" - 66% of respondents; "a negative reaction when I disclosed my LGBT identity" - 29%; "comments that my identity was just a phase" - 21%; and "advice that my orientation could be changed to a heterosexual one" - 13%. There is lingering damage from what was long-standing policy that still reverberates through the system.

I thank Senator Colm Burke for his support. He wonders if the Bill is sufficient to ensure that a parent cannot remove someone from the State. Senator Bacik mentioned female genital mutilation, FGM, as did Senator Colm Burke. We took that piece from the FGM legislation. Whether it needs to be slightly amended remains to be seen.

I thank Senator Higgins for her very beautiful words on the need for legislators to bring love to the conversation. I thank Senator Norris for reading those emails. It is really important that we allow the voices of people to be heard. The second email he read was about Ace, who eventually took his own life. We have to consider the international dimension. As a member of the LGBT community, wherever I go I will research what it is like to be LGBT in that country. Most of the issues we debate here on LGBT rights get coverage in the international press. We can set the example. Others cannot celebrate Pride, let alone speak in their parliament. They will look to Ireland for international best practice. We can provide that best practice.

I thank everyone who has spoken. I wish I could go through all the issues. I will conclude by saying that those who are distressed about their sexuality should only be offered interventions that support them for who they are.

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