John Paul Phelan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

Yes. There are some Members of this House who said that we should stick with the link between Senators and councillors. Absolutely not. If councillors are to get the PRSI entitlements to get the pension entitlements, this link between councillors and a grade in the public service is the crucial step in getting the other ancillary benefits for councillors, as well as the pay issue.This is about much more than pay. It is about recognition and about saying that, as a councillor, one is a public servant. Some have been councillors for 40 years and the Senator listed a few, I could name a few myself that are there a long time, and there must be a pension at the end of it for them. It will mean, probably in the initial years at least, that there will be a hybrid system. I suspect that we will not be able to do retrospective pensions for everyone, but there should be a combination of the current lump sum with other intricacies, which are to be worked out by this review group.

I want to finish by saying that I have never given any promises on the subject, other than that I think there should be a link between councillors and the public service directly, not just through Members of this House. A review should happen. I am glad to say we are going to have the review and it will be May to October 2018 with a view towards as immediate an implementation as we can possibly have. I suspect that other letters might have to be drafted about that in the future, but we need to get the first stage of the process completed, which is to scope out the role of councillors, what they should be doing in the future and paying them a proper, full remuneration package that is commensurate with the work they do and the role they have.