Damien English (Meath West, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I think we had a lengthy discussion on this amendment previously but I will do a little bit of recapping. I accept what Senator Boyhan has said. Some genuinely had an expectation that there would be a vote on this. We were very clear, certainly in the discussion in the Dáil when this was referred to committee. What the committee was doing on behalf of both Houses of the Oireachtas was bringing forward the submission and suggestions for the Government to act on, which we did. We were very clear in the Dáil at that stage, last October, about the process. That was the time for the Oireachtas to have its say on that, on behalf of both Houses, and we were quite clear on it. I do accept that some genuinely had expectations. However, others did not but have wanted to approach things differently in the more recent couple of months. I am disappointed in that. I accept people who are genuine and genuinely thought this. Others are just using the system for a different debate, which I am disappointed with because this is a very serious decision on behalf of the country. It is planning up to 2040.

To Senator Murnane O'Connor, I have to say that having spent the last two years working with the guys in the Department who are working on this probably for the last three or four years, we all take this job very seriously. That is why we are looking to 2040. We understand it is about people's lives and understand the seriousness behind it. We have taken our job very seriously here. We have gone out of our way to make sure every Department and agency, any community and anybody who wants to be involved in this has been involved in it. Their thoughts and concerns, I would say, have been quite well represented with all the different changes. We went to the regional meetings and local authority meetings. I do believe there has been a lot of consultation. We do accept and believe how important this is to people's lives. While we might not agree with the Senators' amendments and the process they want - there is a reason for that which I will go through - we do recognise how serious it is. A lot of work was put into this plan by many people.This has not happened in the past for whatever reason. It involved every Department and Government agency to bring everybody on board. We are trying to ensure real genuine long-term planning for this country which was not been done in the past. I am disappointed the Senators do not necessarily recognise that but I understand that for different reasons, different things have happened.

I do not propose to accept amendments Nos. 34 and 35 relating to the adoption of the national planning framework as tabled by the Sinn Féin Senators and Senator Murnane O'Connor, respectively. The objectives of the national planning framework are fundamental to the achievement of long-term economic, social and environmental sustainability. A more balanced distribution of population and employment growth is considered essential to safeguarding the economy's growth and potential, as well as pre-empting the risk that economic growth would be seriously constrained by congestion costs. Through the national planning framework and as part of the ten-year capital investment plan, it is intended that the different regions' capabilities and strengths will be boosted to manage future population and economic growth over the next 20 years, catering for an extra 1 million people, and an additional 650,000 jobs and 500,000 more homes.

Following its publication, we need to get on with implementing the framework and translate the broad principles into regional and local actions, supported by co-ordinated and prioritised investment at central and local levels. A formal vote on the final planning framework was never envisaged under this legislation. I accept some Senators genuinely thought it was. It was intended all parties would have a formal opportunity to discuss and have an input into the drafting process. This has been facilitated through a motion approved by both Houses of the Oireachtas last autumn, referring the draft national planning framework, published last November, to the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government for its consideration and to submit a report to the Minister. The committee met and sent a formal submission on behalf of both Houses of the Oireachtas. I assume every Senator had an opportunity to feed into that. As a Minister of State, I attended that committee, as well as the rural affairs committee, on this draft. The intention of the process was always clear. This was accepted and it went through without being opposed in the Dáil.

The Bill has two key provisions in this regard relating to submitting the draft framework for the approval of both Houses before it is published and the Government having regard to any resolution or a report from the Oireachtas in finalising the framework. We have been faithful to both of those commitments in the Bill despite the fact that, as yet, it has no legal standing. We have carefully listened to and taken on board many of the issues raised on all sides of the Houses. Having devoted a significant amount of effort to managing and integrating views from across all parties into the final document, there is an urgent need to finalise and adopt this framework and its complementary ten-year capital plan. This will mean strategic planning and infrastructure investment can be undertaken to meet the pressing needs of our growing and resurgent economy, as well as wider society. To further delay this extensive process for political debate would deny citizens the implementation of the plan they need. In addition, there will be further opportunities to elaborate on the national planning framework at regional and local levels through the subsequent regional spatial and economic strategies, the preparation of which has been going on in each of the different regions and which will be completed by the end of 2018 and, ultimately, in city and county and development plans.

If one engages with local authorities, they want this process under way. Local authorities are due to complete their development plans. It is best that all of those plans will be aligned to the regional strategy and the national plan. They want clarity around this and have asked us to get on with it. It is a pity the legislation got delayed in this House. It started nearly two years ago and it is still not finished. It would be wrong to delay planning for our country for another couple of months. It was hoped the national planning framework would be in place at the back end of last year but we are seven months behind. I would be disappointed if votes were used in this House which will not achieve what they hope and will just delay the planning framework. I am not sure what the motives involved are when I consider the consultation we already have had. I am not sure the people the Senators represent would be grateful for this.

The amendment proposes that the national planning framework can only be placed on a statutory footing once the Government submits the document, together with the environmental report and the appropriate assessment report for the amendment and approval by each House of the Oireachtas. If the intention of the proposed amendment is about putting the document published by the Government on 16 February last on a statutory footing, then it is unnecessary. This is because, having regard to the provisions of section 2 of the Act, there is an existing mechanism for legally recognising the status of the national planning framework. My Department has already written to local authorities and An Bord Pleanála advising them of this fact. If the national spatial strategy was mentioned in the end, the meaning of section 2 is such that those references have now been replaced by the national planning framework. The Act refers to the spatial strategy of 2002 or any replacement documents. The national planning framework is the new spatial strategy. It assumes that position and is on a statutory footing.

More generally, it is regrettable that Sinn Féin put down this amendment to draw back the document published by the Government on 16 February last and which has been subject to extensive public consultation for a retrospective vote and presumably alteration. As parliamentarians, we need to think about such a move carefully. If the amendment were passed and the rug was pulled from under the national planning framework, what do we say to the thousands of people who have already made submissions and are satisfied the Government has listened to finalise the document on a fair and balanced basis? Most people accept it and the follow-on regional plans were fair and balanced. There is a great danger the amendment would be seen as an attempt to subjugate the consultation process already undertaken in good faith and before legislation is processed simply for political purposes without considering the practical effects such a vote would have, notwithstanding the fact that the document has to be finalised long before this Bill will have legal effect.

We need to think carefully about the full legal and practical effect of this amendment in terms of the EU environmental law requirements it will bring down on all our heads. Further legal advice is required from the Attorney General's office but it would appear that the amendment would have the effect of making Dáil Éireann the competent authority for the purposes of considering and approving the environmental report under the strategic environmental assessment, SEA, directive and the appropriate assessment under the habitats directive. Moreover, if, subsequent to a vote, the document was to be amended, then the Members of Dáil Éireann would be drawn into a complex legal and scientific area that may have a whole series of unintended consequences regarding scope to make or amend policy. For example, many Members might want even more flexibility than exists already on one-off housing. It would be likely that an appropriate assessment would become problematic from a habitats perspective, triggering complex legal mechanisms for which we will be responsible. It will not be the officials or experts who have worked on this for years.

Our job is as legislators and to provide oversight. Every Member has a different agenda. While that is fine, putting that into a national framework for every town, village and area we represent will not end up with the good planning Senators often talk about. There is a process there for a reason and that is what we are trying to buy into. This legislation is about putting the whole process around formulating future national planning frameworks on a proper legal footing. We have done this to the spirit of the law. That is what Mahon asked for. Mahon did not ask that Dáil Éireann would vote on every decision which comes with a massive planning framework document. The experts are planners. Some Members might have some planning training but we are not all experts in it. If Senators believe they are the right ones to make all planning decisions, then so be it. However, I am not sure that is the right decision for this country when it comes to planning decisions. Senators should reflect on these amendments. They should put politics to one side and look at what we are trying to achieve with this. A review is proposed after six years. On Report Stage, we can examine having that review earlier. These amendments are not a wise move. I understand the intentions behind them but I am not sure they have been fully thought out from a planning point of view. Senators should bear in mind these amendments would put all planning decisions involving environmental and other directives on legislators who already have other legislation to deal with. The Government believes in consultation on this plan and has done so with it.That is why we had the process, which will continue.

There is a regional aspect to this and all the different political parties are very much involved. I, as Minister of State, the Minister, Deputy Eoghan Murphy, the Tánaiste, Deputy Coveney, before him and our officials have travelled around the country meeting anybody who wants to discuss this matter. We have a full open-door policy. We have discussed it at regional meetings, council meetings, open forums, etc. Niall Cussens and others from the Department have attended many events. It is a fully open-book approach, as required under the recommendations of the Mahon tribunal. That is what we are trying to do. If someone doubts that, he or she should say it now. I assure Senators that this is the case, particularly as I have been around the country discussing the matter. No question was left unanswered. The final document reflects the views raised with me at those meetings and at Oireachtas committee meetings. We have a balanced document but, again, the regional involvement can also add to that or change it as much as possible. Senators should bear the latter in mind when pressing these amendments. If they want to discuss the matter further at a meeting prior to Report Stage, I have no problem doing that.