Paudie Coffey (Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

On lobbying, the impression is being created that lobbying is happening on only one side. I have been lobbied by those in favour of the Bill as currently drafted and also locally by shopkeepers and others who are genuinely concerned about the impact this legislation may have on them. I am not confused. I am taking an objective, informed view of the Bill and I am expressing views that I believe we, as legislators, need tease out in this House. This is landmark legislation. It is critical legislation in the interests of public health. I support it and I want to see it work. I want to see in place practical, tangible legislation that will bring all of the stakeholders with us to eradicate the abuse of alcohol in this country. That is what we all want to achieve. How we achieve it is the issue.

The Minister may correct me if I am wrong but as I understand it over 80% of alcohol sold in Ireland is sold through the large multiples. Trolley loads of cheap alcoholic drinks are being by these large stores. I have no issue with segregation in these stores because I believe they can afford it. Many of them have already done this already. These stores advertise aggressively. The advertisement and promotion of alcohol is constant in all of the newspapers and will be even more aggressive in the run up to Christmas. This is why sales are so exaggerated and the access is so easy. The remaining 20% is sold in small shops and off-licences. As I understand it, only 8% of it is sold in small shops. By way of example, I have never seen anybody leave the Centra store in my area with slabs or crates of beer. I have seen people purchase a bottle of wine or, at maximum, a six pack of beer but I have not seen trolley loads of beer leaving my local Centra store.

The target of this legislation must be the large-scale sale of cheap beer by the multiples. We need to be careful and to ensure we take a balanced approach in terms of how we implement this legislation. I am happy to raise the concerns of small to medium shopkeepers because I know they are responsible professional people who live and work in their communities and know the parents and children in their communities. Many of them know the customers to whom they are serving alcohol by their first names. They are responsible people. The situation in the multiples is different given the volumes of people passing through them every day.

Like my colleagues, I want to work with the Minister to make this legislation effective and workable and also to bring stakeholders with us. We can have all the ideologies and ambitions we want for legislation but unless it is effective on the ground and unless we bring stakeholders with us, we will not achieve the impact we want. I believe the people on the front line are the shopkeepers. They are the ones meeting people every day and the vast of majority of them have been responsible. This is evident in terms of their adherence to the voluntary code over the past number of years. Strong progress has been made in terms of managing the sale of alcohol in small shops. I am not trying to create trouble for the Government. I am simply raising concerns on behalf of people that I know and live among in communities, which I believe, collectively, we can address. For this reason, I believe the turnstile proposal should be examined. I note that these amendments are not being pressed and I welcome that. I believe we should allow Committee Stage to pass today and I will be supportive of that. This cannot happen without the Minister's co-operation. I acknowledge that he has offered to engage with the retail sector to clarify if, as we are hearing, what is proposed is draconian. It is important clarification is brought to that debate. In my view, the installation of a turnstile in a small and medium shop such that children cannot access alcohol should suffice.

Other measures being introduced via this legislation will directly address the fundamental cause of alcohol abuse, namely, access to cheap volumes of beer. I want to acknowledge the Minister's effort in bringing forward his own amendment and I thank his officials for the document they have produced on the impact on stores of what is proposed. I hope that the retail sector and others will engage with the Minister in a proactive manner - I expect they will - because I have previously picked up on in that sector a sense of disillusionment regarding the engagement to date on these amendments. I welcome that we are now engaging with the retail sector, which is an important stakeholder in this area. This sector can play an important role in terms of the control of the sale of alcohol in this country. The retail sector is made up of responsible professionals, with small shops located in every community in this country. We should not make pariahs of responsible adults who want to buy alcohol, shopkeepers who are trying to manage their businesses or politicians who are expressing views. I have been attacked by people on the basis that I am in favour of alcohol and alcohol abuse. I am not in favour of either. As set out in my contribution earlier, I am well aware of the huge problem we have with alcohol in this country and I support this Bill. However, we need to balanced in our approach to ensure our legislation works.

I welcome that the Minister has offered engagement with the stakeholders. Let us have that engagement and then come back to the table with something that is workable and brings stakeholders with us. We need to do that if this legislation is to work.