Colm Burke (Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the Minister of State and wish him every success in his role in this area. Many people have referred to the fair deal scheme. We are spending roughly €1 billion per annum and, at the moment, there are some 23,500 people in nursing homes under the scheme. If we take the number of people who will retire and require support over the next ten years and apply the same ratio, then, technically, we will end up with some 40,000 people in nursing homes. I do not think that is a viable option so, obviously, we have to look at alternatives, make sure those alternatives are suitable and make sure that people get adequate support in their own homes, if at all possible, although there are a number of challenges in that area.

There are also a number of challenges for the nursing home sector. I have to declare my interest in the sense that I was nominated by Nursing Homes Ireland to contest the Seanad election. While they come in for criticism, nursing homes also face many challenges in regard to cost, including issues like insurance and commercial rates. One nursing home in Leitrim saw its commercial rates rise from €52,000 a year to €104,000 a year as a result of a revaluation. There are many costs that do not apply to the community hospitals. For example, the HSE facility in Donegal is costing over €20 million for 130 beds. When considering the costs for that facility, it must be remembered it is not paying off a loan or interest, whereas, if it was private enterprise, it would be. That is one of the issues we seem to be missing when we are discussing public and private. We have a very high level of costs in regard to our public facilities, in some part because there is a higher degree of care required. This is one of the issues the private nursing homes are highlighting, namely, if they are expected to look after people with greater needs, then they have to be adequately provided for in order to provide the level of care those people require. It is a very important point.

On another issue, many of the community facilities throughout the country do not come under the fair deal scheme. I know of one case where there are 26 people in a facility which was run by an order of nuns who have all retired. The fire authority recently inspected the place and said it wants three staff permanently on duty at night. The cost to the HSE of running that facility, even though it is not a nursing home and although all of the people are living independently, is working out at some €35,000 per patient per annum. It is a challenge we now have in a number of facilities throughout the country and one we will have to address.

I want to address the issue in regard to farms as it is very important. I know of a number of very difficult cases. In one case a farm was left to the son. Unfortunately, the son died tragically without having made a will and, therefore, the farm reverted to the parent. The parent delayed transferring to a second son, partly because none of the family qualified for the agricultural relief. The second son who got the farm then had to pay the full amount of inheritance or gift tax. Some 12 months later the parent was admitted to a nursing home and the farm is now being taken into account in calculating the contribution. The second case is where a father died and half the farm went to the sons and half to the wife. She developed a gradual illness and, at the age of 55 or 56, was admitted to a nursing home. They are now paying €2,500 a month to the nursing home because, again, the farm was taken into account. They are not in a position to do this and are finding it very difficult. They are supported from off-farm income because the farm is not generating enough. Those are two cases I am dealing with at the moment.

It is an issue we need to consider. There were proposals in regard to inheritance tax whereby the land would be devalued by 90% and that valuation would be taken into account as a way of calculating the asset value. That needs to given serious consideration.

The other issue I want to raise is how we calculate interest on money invested. I will give an example. The current position is that if I sell a house and have €190,000 in the bank, I am deemed to be earning €520 a week, which is over €25,000 a year. The Minister of State and I know that I will not earn that kind of interest on €190,000. We then wonder why people will not sell the family home. The interest calculation is very simple. The first €35,000 is not taken into account, the next €10,000 is calculated at €1 per week, the next €10,000 is calculated at €2 per week, the next at €4 per week, and so on. On €190,000, I am deemed to be earning €520 per week in interest. That needs to be changed if we want to encourage people to sell the family home so we do not have vacant houses. It is a very important point that we need to take on board because we cannot leave matters as they currently stand.

With regard to home care, as I have said before in the House, if I serve ten years in prison, I can come out the following morning and set up a company to provide home care, and there is no regulation to prevent me doing so. I have no difficulty with anyone who totally reforms, having served time in prison, but I believe we are wide open at the moment due to lack of regulation. I know there are voluntary codes and all the rest but we need proper regulation, which is why I introduced a Private Members' Bill on this matter. The Law Reform Commission has prepared a very detailed report on this and we should take it on board in regard to future regulation.