Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank Senators for a very interesting and broadly constructive debate. I will do my best to answer as many questions as I can to which I have the answers. I might not have jotted all of them down, but I will do my best to cover as many issues as I can.

JobPath does not take precedence over the community employment programme. It is just that we do not allow people to switch from one scheme or programme to another. We do not want somebody to spend one month on a community employment scheme and then suddenly move to Tús, or to spend two months on a Tús scheme and then proceed to Gateway. We do not want to see people chopping and changing between schemes and programmes. If somebody has a starting date for a community employment scheme within four weeks, he or she can participate in the scheme, but we do not want people who over a period of three years could have participated in a community employment scheme suddenly finding they have an interest in a community employment scheme when referred to JobPath. I have come across plenty of such examples. Ideally, we want to move to a jobs-first model, whereby people who are trying to find a job in the first year are supported in this regard. We are moving towards this. When people are not able to find a job, the most appropriate place for them is on a community employment scheme.

It is absolutely the case that those who run many community employment schemes are having real difficulty in filling vacancies. I am very concerned about this. I do not want to see the very important services provided by community employment schemes such as meals on wheels, TidyTowns work, child care services and some social care services no longer being provided. Much of this work should properly be done through Government agencies and Departments, but that is a battle I will have to have with my colleagues in time to come. I would like to see some of the services transition to normal arrangements. I certainly do not want them to fall by the wayside. I am determined to ensure that will not be the case because of the real value of the work in question, be it fixing pitches or other jobs. This is really important, as we all know from our constituencies.

The reason those who run community employment and Tús schemes are having difficulty in recruiting is not solely JobPath; there is a much bigger story to be told. We had a certain number of community employment schemes and increased the number of places by approximately 10,000. We then added Tús, Gateway and JobBridge. Now there is JobPath. We have seen nearly a quadrupling of the number of services and schemes available, but the unemployment rate has reduced by half in the meantime. What does one expect to happen in these circumstances? Of course, it will be harder to fill places if the unemployment rate is down by one half, if not more. That the number of schemes and services has increased dramatically is the reason those run schemes are having difficulty in filling places, but I do want to do something about it. I am working with my colleagues to widen the pool of people eligible to participate in community employment schemes. Younger people, for example, are currently not eligible. There are also people who are timed out because of a rule that one can serve only a certain number of years on a community employment scheme. I refer, in particular, to those who have been involved in JobPath for one year. Tens of thousands of people have spent one year on JobPath and not got a job. They, in particular, should be encouraged to enter the community employment programme. We need to challenge community employment scheme supervisors, in particular, and sponsors not to try to hang on to the person with whom they are comfortable and who is doing a great job and does not need much help. We need to challenge them to find the people who do not have a job through JobPath such as those in receipt of disability or lone parent or other long-term payments and try to encourage them to take up places. What would really help in that regard – it is obviously a matter to be considered in the context of the next budget – is increasing the top-up received by participants in these schemes. It is approximately €22.50, which is not an awful lot. If one participates in a community employment or Tús scheme, for example, and receives the additional payment, one might even be worse off by the time one covers the cost of lunch or transport two or three days a week. I would like to see that issue dealt with in the next budget, if I can get the finances to do so.

JobPath does represent a policy shift. It is a job-first approach. The idea is to try to get people into work in the first instance and also to accept that it is quite normal to work and at the same time receive training and education, be it part-time, at night or at weekends.The idea is to try to get people into work and to accept the fact that it is quite normal for people to be in work and involved in training and education at the same time. We have probably all done it, whether it was part-time, at night or at weekends. This is the kind of person an employer wants and they are sceptical about people who spend their entire lives going from training scheme to training scheme, then back to welfare and another training scheme. Some people spend ten years on a carousel of training schemes, welfare, a CE scheme, more welfare and another training scheme and they do not get jobs. What we are implementing is much better, though there will be exceptions and we must accept that one size does not fit all.

It is not accurate to characterise the companies as British or English. Turas Nua is headquartered in Roscrea and I opened the headquarters. Its major partner is Farm Recruitment Services, FRS. People who know rural Ireland will know that company as the people who recruit people for agriculture.

I am a little bit confused by Senator Devine's remarks about being upset at the neoliberal idea that companies should be allowed to bid for contracts. God forbid it be a foreign company or, even worse, a British one.