Finian McGrath (Dublin Bay North, Independent) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Senators for their contributions and their support for the commission of investigation. They have probably heard that I met yesterday with colleagues from across the House and listened to their concerns, as I am listening to Senators' major concerns and points today. The revised terms of reference have been circulated and people know about the issues with which I am dealing. Another important issue that did not necessarily come up today is the order to establish the commission. Some changes were made to that order. My bottom line is that I want to get the commission established so that it can begin its important work and get to the truth.

I again thank Senators for their passionate support for Grace. Senator Davitt was concerned that six months was too long for the interim report. Based on my experience and talking to people directly involved in it, I can say that this is an achievable target. It will be difficult to achieve it but I do not think it is too long. Based on the chairperson and background negotiations, I think we will get to it and the target is achievable.

Senator Colm Burke asked why we are again setting up another commission of investigation. It is very sad and frustrating. It is a case of "here we go again." I would rather have the €5 million to spend on respite services in Mayo, Galway, Cork or Dublin but we must get to the truth and find out what happened in the interests of Grace. The Senator also mentioned monitoring and checks. I find the allegations appalling. If a child fell in a schoolyard today, a little book in the teacher's office would state "fell 3.15" or some such. If the child got two stitches, there would be records and evidence of it. This happens for regular small accidents. I am blown away by some of the allegations.

Senator Devine raised the very important question of whether we ever get anything right. Stories like this are very upsetting to read about but I also think it is important to put on the record of the House that there are wonderful foster parents throughout the State who do a fantastic job. I take this opportunity to commend them for the work they have done. That is very important because without those foster parents, we would have a major crisis in our child care services. The Senator also asked whether there were any interventions from Ministers. A Minister and a Minister of State intervened but that is included in the terms of reference and will be investigated by the commission of investigation.It is important that that goes on the record as well.

Senator Conway-Walsh raised the issue of the 47 others. She asked whether Grace is safe now. The answer is absolutely "Yes". She is in a very safe residential unit with wonderful care staff at last. However, there is a side of me now that asks what happened to that vulnerable poor young woman. The other very important issue that Senator Conway-Walsh mentioned is the issue of trust in our health services and our disability services. There is no point in saying otherwise: it has been damaged. I am hoping that through this commission of inquiry, we will get the truth and the facts, deal with it and build up the trust that we need to build. The Senator also raised the question of sanctioning people who do not co-operate. The commission of inquiry will compel people to attend.

Senator Kelleher raised the issue of everybody's focus being on their own interests before that of Grace. That is something I strongly agree with. I think the Senator is 100% right. Again, I am only a few months in the job as Minister of State. I always say that there are three things I want to do as Minister of State. I want to reform, invest and the third thing, which I always emphasise, is to put the person with the disability at the centre of the service - not the HSE, not the Minister, not the Department of Health, not Seanad Éireann, but the person with the disability. In this case, without going into detail, I feel that everybody else's interests came first. That is my view. It is a very strong view. As far as I am concerned, that view is non-negotiable. We have to go down that road and deal with that. Senator Kelleher's point about legislation is absolutely right. We have to bring in legislation. Some of us are drafting legislation. I believe the Senator is preparing legislation and I wish her well in that regard. I know that other colleagues and some in my office are dealing with this issue as well. We have to have legislation in place to safeguard others.

It is important to remember that while all of this is going on, we were not sitting around for the last seven or eight months. We have started to bring a lot of safeguards into the services. That is important. We have the national policy, Safeguarding Vulnerable Persons at Risk of Abuse. That is being implemented. We also have an excellent national committee under an independent chair, Ms Patricia Rickard Clarke. We also have a quality improvement enable programme, a national volunteer advocacy programme and the establishment of a family for working with Inclusion Ireland. We work closely with Inclusion Ireland. We also have a confidential recipient, Ms Leigh Gath. We are doing a lot of these things to safeguard vulnerable people, but we do need legislation as well and I accept that. There is no point saying that we do not. That is long overdue.

Senator Bacik spoke about whistleblowers. I have met the whistleblowers on two occasions. I have listened to their concerns. When we were revising the terms of reference, I met them again on Tuesday. Hearing some of the other points they made was one of the reasons we revised the section dealing with whistleblowers. We have to hear them and guarantee they are protected. We also have to hear the allegations that they were penalised for their work.

The bottom line is that there is a broader issue here for society. We have a dark history. We have discussed Tuam, mother and baby homes and other issues. There are other cases out there. That is the sad news. These are some of the things I see when I go into work everyday. I see cases and allegations of abuse and it is absolutely horrific. There is that dark side of Irish society.

We also have to look at the broader context of the State, the institutions and society as well. With regard to Tuam and the society of the time, a lot of the families and people left those young vulnerable mothers in institutions and disregarded them. That was a reality and a fact of life at that time. In broader society today, and the National Disability Authority will back me up on this, there are still major attitudes to people with disabilities. We have to change those attitudes. That is why we want to take a rights-based approach. I know that all Senators present and their parties are very on message with that.

Senator Ruane raised the issue of staff and accountability. People have to be accountable. To answer the Senator's question honestly, I believe the HSE is starting disciplinary procedures. The bottom line is that I do not want to go into a commission of inquiry, get the results and then find that there is no accountability. People will not buy that and neither will I. It is not natural justice.

I really appreciate the support of Senators. There is cross-party support across Fianna Fáil, Sinn Féin, Fine Gael and all of my Independent colleagues. I appreciate their support. We need to get the facts and the truth, support Grace and, in the end, have accountability.