Charles Flanagan (Laois, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank Senators for their contributions and consideration of the Bill. As I indicated in my opening statement, this Bill has something of a narrow focus. It is concerned with the protection of cultural property in the event of armed conflict. Its enactment will nevertheless be a further important demonstration of Ireland's support for international humanitarian law and the vital role that it plays in limiting the effects of armed conflicts on civilians and civilian property.

Senator Higgins was right when she made the case that we should not only be engaged in what might be a symbolic signing or ratification. She said we should, at all times, be conscious of the need to back that up in terms of our own resources, activities and actualities rather than just symbolism. I hope that the passing of this legislation could be followed by the type of real action to which reference has been made.

I assure the House that this Bill is by no means an attempt by the Executive to introduce legislation to the Legislature for debate and, ultimately, for ratification. This is not a question of prioritising property over people. On the contrary, it is fair to say that the Government has been forthright in its condemnation of the appalling tactics by the parties to the current conflict in Syria as has been evidenced not only in the course of this debate, but in previous debates in the Seanad. I acknowledge the role Senator Bacik played in ensuring the Seanad spoke with one voice on this issue by reaching agreement on a motion. That was very important and I wish to compliment Senators on their contributions to that. It is an important statement by the Oireachtas and the Seanad. The fact that it was agreed without a division was really important. It was also important to me, as Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, and I extend words of appreciation to the Cathaoirleach and all the Members.

I am sure everyone in this House would agree there is no justification for excessive, disproportionate and indiscriminate attacks on a defenceless civilian population and, indeed, critical civilian infrastructure, such as medical installations, hospitals, medi-centres and surgeries and power and sanitation facilities, all of which we have seen in recent weeks in the city of Aleppo. This behaviour, without doubt, violates the relevant rules of international humanitarian law. It is totally unacceptable as are attacks on cultural property. The destruction and theft of cultural property are totally unacceptable. Senator McFadden mentioned in graphic detail the destruction of artefacts in the ancient and culturally important area of Palmyra. Buildings, monuments and artefacts of cultural importance are essential, as has been said, to the history, heritage and identity of all people. Any attempt or deliberate act to destroy them is an attempt to diminish the people and fundamentally injure their identity. It strikes at the heart of humanity. Indeed, the rules set out in the 1954 convention and the 1999 protocol, like those in the Geneva Conventions and other instruments of international humanitarian law, rest on respect for the inherent dignity of the individual.Without them, the barbarism and brutality of armed conflict would remain unmitigated. They are not mere pious aspirations but concrete standards formulated in the light of bitter experience and agreed by the international community as a basis for civilised conduct. It is in this context that the Government proposes that Ireland now becomes a party to the Hague Convention and Protocol, which the enactment of this legislation will facilitate and allow.

A number of specific points were raised by Senators during the course of the debate. Senator Daly rightly adverted to the Baghdad museums. Neither Iraq nor the United States are parties to the 1999 protocol, which would have obliged them to prevent looting of cultural property. It is important that by becoming a party to the protocol, Ireland provides practical support for its rules. We continue to encourage. The passing of this legislation in the Seanad and afterwards in Dáil Éireann will act as an encouraging factor for all states to follow suit.

Reference was made to Palmyra. However, Syria is not a party to the protocol. The United Nations Security Council resolution applies in Ireland and there are criminal offences here under the European Union sanctions regulations relating to Syria. The issue of the destruction in Palmyra was rightly referred to by Senator McFadden and others.

Senator Ó Clochartaigh posed a number of questions. I will deal with them briefly because he is not here. It is important to note that the International Criminal Court will have jurisdiction over offences committed in states that are not parties to the statutes of the court only if they are referred to it by the UN Security Council. That is an established means by which these issues can be dealt with. Reference was made to Iraq. It is clear that neither Syria nor Iraq have ratified the protocol. A total of 69 states are parties. Ireland is pleased to play its part. Syria has signed but not ratified the protocol. Every effort will be made to ensure as many states as possible can participate by signing and ratifying. Senator Ó Clochartaigh raised the issue of Palestine. He will be aware that Israel is a party to the Hague Convention but not yet a party to the second protocol of 1999. Meanwhile, Palestine is a party to both.

I acknowledge the remarks of Senator Higgins with regard to persons taking personal risks in order to safeguard important artefacts and property of cultural and historical significance, not only for our generation but for future generations. The Senator is right. Oftentimes, this requires acts of great courage on the part of individuals. We should applaud such acts, as the Senator has done. The trafficking of cultural objects through our jurisdiction is an issue upon which many in our communities remain vigilant outside of this regulation or protocol, which deals exclusively with armed conflict. We have a body of criminal law and that is the reference point in the context of the trafficking of goods and objects of dubious origin or source. Senator Higgins is correct to speak of the need for actual and real leadership to accompany what we are doing this afternoon.

Senator Richmond referred to foreign fighters and a number of Irish foreign fighters who have been identified as being involved in armed conflict in areas like Syria and Iraq. He also referred to the status of the returnees. Again, a significant body of law already exists on the Statute Book to deal with criminal offences. Obviously, there is a need to gather an appropriate level of evidence. This is an issue upon which I know my colleague, the Tánaiste and Minister for Justice and Equality, has been actively engaged with EU colleagues and other international actors. The sharing of information is vital. I am pleased to note that, as far as Ireland is concerned, everyone would agree that the level of information gathering and sharing between the forces of law and order in this State and our counterparts in other jurisdictions is especially high. In fact, it has never been as close. I hope this will continue. Since we live in a globalised society, the need for sharing information, international protocols, concepts like the European arrest warrant and other international conventions are all important in the context of the gathering of appropriate levels of evidence that will ultimately result in persons engaging in illegal activity being brought to justice.

Senator Richmond also raised the matter of training. That is an issue for the Defence Forces and the Department of Defence. In the context of this Bill there has been a significant degree of discussion between the Defence Forces, the Department of Defence and officials in my Department. I will communicate to the Senator on the matter of training but I agree with his view that this is an important issue and one I will clarify with the Senator before the completion of the legislation.

Senators referred to the status or definition of occupied territory. Occupied territory is territory occupied by an invading force after fighting. A point was made about whether this Bill would be relevant in respect of states, countries, members or parties engaged in armed conflict and what would happen afterwards. When can the conflict be regarded as having come to an end? Oftentimes that is a matter of dispute. Of course, the removal of cultural property from the occupied territory of a state that is a party to the protocol will be a specific offence in this jurisdiction. There is also the question of Irish residents participating in a war in Syria and what will happen to them once the appropriate investigation has taken place. Action will take place in respect of persons being suspected of an offence. This will be a matter for the Garda Síochána, as it is in respect of all and any offences across the range of criminal justice issues.

The authorities here are aware of the issue of international foreign fighters. This legislation deals with the theft of cultural property outside the State in the context of armed conflict. Ordinary theft remains an offence on the Statute Book and that is the means by which these people would ultimately be brought to justice. There are also conventions which deal specifically with trafficking cultural property. These are under consideration by my colleague, the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs, Deputy Heather Humphreys. She is the line Minister responsible for the matter of funding of the type that has been mentioned by a number of Senators in the context of the consolidation of our legislation, in particular the National Monument Acts.I am happy to raise the issue of funding with the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs, Deputy Heather Humphreys.

I acknowledge the contributions of Senators and thank them for their careful consideration of this Bill, as well as for their advice and guidance. I am pleased to acknowledge the positive perception the Protection of Cultural Property in the Event of Armed Conflict (Hague Convention) Bill 2016 has received and look forward to the continuing support of the House for it.

Senator Bacik raised the issue again of the Syrian conflict. There is a strong participation on our part when dealing with this ongoing issue and the appalling violence on the part of the Assad regime. At this stage, it seems the Assad regime is entirely dependent on the support of outside groups. Without support from Russia, Iran, Hezbollah and a variety of other sectarian militia forces, I have no doubt the brutal regime of terror in Syria under Assad would have collapsed some time ago. Assad's backers know exactly what they are doing. They continue to perpetuate a brutal war by a regime, which lacks any legitimacy, against the Syrian people. I had an opportunity, on behalf of the Seanad, Dáil, the Government and the people of Ireland, to directly convey our revulsion at these activities in Syria. I spoke directly to the Russian ambassador, the representative of the Russian Government here, and made it clear to him in no uncertain terms that we regard the actions of his government as being totally unacceptable in these circumstances.

This conflict has given rise to an unprecedented migration challenge for the European Union and for Ireland. I am having ongoing discussions with my colleague, the Tánaiste and Minister for Justice and Equality, on the intake and reception in this jurisdiction of a number of refugees in accordance with our stated target of 4,000 people. I acknowledge the process is slow and it needs to be the subject of some order. I regret the administrative issues are such that there is a level of frustration on the part of elected representatives, as well as among the wider public. This is an issue upon which we are anxious to proceed in a way that will demonstrate to our people and the international community that Ireland continues to be willing to play its part in a way we can ensure the suffering of these individuals is mitigated, that they can enjoy a welcome in this jurisdiction and settle in our rural and urban communities for a period to be determined. I am happy to communicate with Senators on this ongoing matter, as I am sure the Tánaiste and Minister for Justice and Equality is doing.