Seanad debates

Tuesday, 20 October 2015

Marriage Bill 2015: Second Stage

 

2:30 pm

Photo of Fidelma Healy EamesFidelma Healy Eames (Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the Minister and the fact this Marriage Bill is before us. Without doubt, this referendum provoked an awful lot of different feelings in Irish people, in myself and in many others. I was in Dublin Castle on the day the result was announced. I was a "No" voter and I felt truly saddened that so many people and citizens did not feel equal before the result of this referendum. I was particularly touched by the emotions expressed by Deputy John Lyons as the result came in. The occasion made me question how we had not felt equal - gay and straight - for so long. A friend of mine's daughter is a young gay woman who is 19 years of age. She said to me, "Fidelma, I don't know how I'll cope if this referendum isn't passed." On hearing that, I thought we have long way to go to understand what equality means if we are all equal citizens of this country. It is not easy for me to speak today because I am perhaps the only person here who was a "No" voter and yet still an advocate for equality. I was an advocate for equality before the referendum and I remain one. I have always believed all of our citizens are equal and equal in our difference. Somehow or other that sentiment was not conveyed, which saddened me. I decided to speak today because I believe that if the "No" side of this campaign is not expressed here, then we will continue to exclude more people. For too long, we have had too much exclusion.

I completely respect the campaign Senator Norris had to undertake to achieve what he did. For too long, gay people did not have constitutional rights. I do not wish to rehash the referendum debate but I supported civil partnership in this House. I have long believed in constitutional rights for gay people but believe that if equality was what was at issue, then it should have come under a different article in the Constitution. That was where my difference was.

The result was convincing. I acknowledge the 60:40 result but I guess it was not unanimous. Rather than take pride in the fact that some people lost and some people won, I would like to state today that we need to respect and tolerate difference. The tolerance of sexual difference is vital but tolerance of opinion and views is also vital.

I received much communication after the referendum from people who felt disenfranchised and it is important to put some of that on the record. I accept that for too long gay people felt disenfranchised. In one communication, a person stated that for the first time in their life, following the referendum result, they felt ashamed to be identified as Irish and asked how many more people on the "No" side felt a similar dejection by the locked out, feeling disenfranchised by the phalanx of political parties that did not seem to realise that there was an Irish identity there that they all helped to kill. They stated further that it had to be concluded that the Taoiseach that facilitated the referendum was lacking in the core sense of Irish and was perhaps too willing to facilitate the wishes of international political heavyweights such as Cameron, Merkel and Obama. I had put that on the record not to rain on anyone's parade or be a killjoy but simply to say that we have to be careful that we do not lock out other people. In every referendum, there are winners and losers. We are trying to be a more inclusive society but people must go on a journey. Irish people had to go on a journey and the result has been convincing. However, we must be careful in cases where political parties and a Government are all on the one side and understand how that is perceived as disenfranchising people.

We will deal with other Stages of the Bill and I will raise other issues, such as the age of marriage which Senator van Turnhout brought up, and impediments to marriage, which the Minister spoke about. I am talking about impediments to all marriages - gay and straight.

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