Caít Keane (Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

Cuirim fáilte roimh an Aire Stáit go dtí an Teach. I thank Senator Barrett for the statement he delivered from the father, or prince, of the House, Senator David Norris. I wish him well in his recovery. I compliment Senator Barrett on keeping the debate alive by putting this proposal on the agenda today. The question of when the Seanad franchise will be extended has been one of the most talked about issues in recent months in the context of political reform. It has been 21 years since the establishment of the University of Limerick and Dublin City University and even longer since the referendum was passed allowing for the extension of the third level franchise. It is a great shame that no move has been made to implement reform in this regard before now. What we are seeing are only baby steps, but after 21 years it is good to see something.

Back in March we debated the general scheme of the Government's Seanad Electoral (University Members) (Amendment) Bill in this House. Since then, the public consultation which followed on from the publication of those proposals has closed. I look forward to what the Government comes up with when it collates all of the submissions it has received, its own proposals and the Bills introduced by Senators Crown, Quinn and Zappone, and Senator Barrett. If this House is noted for one thing, it is its capacity to improve legislation. It is only by listening to what people here are saying that the Government will come up with something better.

There is, of course, a great deal to be done and it is not a simple task. Whenever Government tries to do something within the confines of legislation rather than the Constitution, it is working to some extent with its hands tied behind its back. The Seanad was established under the Constitution and if we are to change it by legislation, it will only be changeable in certain elements. Every Member of this particular Seanad has already seen some changes about the place. It is notable, for example, that most of the 11 Taoiseach's nominees are not members of either party of government. That change was a one-day wonder, forgotten about quickly like every piece of good news. There is more to be done, but one cannot do everything in one day.

Senator Barrett's Bill recommends extending the university franchise to all third level institutions but with a different methodology for the traditional university seats. He also proposes splitting the cultural and educational panel into two separate panels. My concern is that by treating the new third level institutions to be included in the franchise differently, there might be a view that they are somehow yellow pack, in contrast to the "real" universities. That is not something I want to see happening. All the third level institutions should be on the same footing.

I welcome the fact that the institutions listed in the Senator's Bill correspond more or less exactly with the list contained in the Government proposal. We all support the objective of extending the third level franchise but, as I said, I have concerns regarding the Senator's proposal to split the cultural and educational panel. Education is not something that need be narrowly defined. An industrial and cultural panel is also an educational panel and should include third level graduates. I am not suggesting that the Senator is proposing that any particular panel be deemed to be lesser than any other. However, assigning the newly-enfranchised institutions to a panel separate from the older universities might lead to problems.

My understanding of the technical provisions of the Bill is that there would be a two-year lead-in before the electoral arrangements would become operational. This approach would effectively rule out any change before the next Seanad election, which I suspect is not the Senator's intention. Will he clarify that?

Regarding the proposal to break up and reconstitute the panels, I see no problem with that being done by way of legislation. A question arises, however, in respect of the designation of universities as returning officers under the existing provisions. Would legislation on its own be sufficient to effect the changes envisaged in Senator Barrett's proposals without altering the theory, so to speak, of the returning officer? I suggest we could replicate legislation from Article 33 of the Free State Constitution to establish a cross-party or non-party system for representation of important interests and institutions in the country, but that is a matter for another day.

Will the Minister of State indicate when the Government intends to publish its legislation on foot of the consultation process that recently concluded?

The franchise is being extended to the remaining third level institutions and this means that an additional 73,000 people will have a vote.

I have a great deal more to say on the matter but time is against me. I thank Senator Barrett for introducing the Bill but I must point out that there are many types of intelligence which it fails to contemplate. I would like all forms of intelligence, and not just that contemplated by a university education, to be represented. I am of the view that there are certain types of intelligence which are more important than that which comes from an academic education. I will not list them all now but will instead wait until a later date to do so.