Sean Barrett (Independent) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the Minister of State at the Department of the Environment, Community and Local Government, Deputy Fergus O'Dowd, to the House. It is appropriate to say, in the presence of a Louth Minister of State, that when one crossed the Louth border on counting day, 6 October 2013, there was a large area all through Meath and Kildare and down through the Dublin constituencies that ended quite close to Killarney, to which was added Galway and Donegal to give the constituencies of the 634,000 people who voted confidence in this House. That was remarkable, given the range of political opinion in the Dáil and elsewhere that was against the continuation of this House. In that context, having such an endorsement of the Seanad by the public, against all the odds and against the opinion polls, how do we develop the House in the way in which public opinion so strongly supported?

In presenting the Bill, which is the fifth one I have introduced, I thank the Bills office, the Leader's office, the Seanad office, Professor Eoin O'Dell in Trinity College, who gave important legal advice, and my assistants Dr. Charles Larkin and Ms Ursula Ní Choill. One of the statements I used most in the debate about the future of this House was to dispute the one by Lord Edward Fitzgerald and quoted by John F. Kennedy in the famous speech which is commemorated at the bottom of the stairs: "Leinster House does not inspire the brightest ideas". That is why Lord Edward Fitzgerald went to live in Carton. I live near Carton and come in here every day. Leinster House does inspire the brightest ideas. I have never come here on any one day when I did not learn something or was not inspired. Parliament has a huge role to play, and maybe, based on events of recent days, an increasing role, as it appears that many in the permanent Government are dysfunctional and require the intervention of Ministers and the Taoiseach in certain Departments. We have a vital role to play. That vital role was expressed in the debate by the Leader, Senator Maurice Cummins. Blocking legislation is not what the Seanad is about. Improving and enhancing legislation is the key contribution we make to the legislative process. At the time Senator Cummins made his contribution, the House had proposed more than 600 amendments, and we have not slowed down much since then.

We have a House which was endorsed by the public in a referendum against all the odds.

Others Bills have come from Senator Zappone, Senator Crown and the Government. In this Bill we seek to move the process of reform forward and to retain and enhance the Seanad as public opinion indicated so recently.
The father of the House, Senator Norris, is indisposed. In a sense, this is Hamlet without the prince. However, he asked me to pass on his regards and this statement:

First of all, let me say there should be full reform of the Seanad and I believe this Bill to be an important part of such reform. Of all the groups within the Seanad the university seats have played the most significant role. The are the most democratic and least elitist because one does not have to be a graduate to stand for election. This will be equally true if this Bill is passed. Anyone from the education and cultural panel would have the right to stand for the education seats. No one would be denied this important right. The Government's reaction to this Bill will be a true test of their sincerity in addressing reform of the Seanad. I am very grateful to Professor Barrett for giving me this opportunity to contribute to this important debate.

That is the end of the statement from the father of the House, Senator Norris.
We are proposing to create eight seats on the cultural and educational panel, four more seats for the universities and institutes of higher education, and four seats for educational and cultural representation. The advice we have from Eoin O'Dell of Trinity College Dublin is that this is constitutional. It maintains the voice of small groupings and keeps room for non-party participants in the political process. It fills the void left by the absence of a cross-bench tradition in the Seanad. It keeps the Parliament open to important segments of society, which we found significant during the referendum. In all the college debates we found that young people overwhelmingly wanted the Seanad kept. They aspired to fill the university seats later in their careers. We found decidedly strong support in Dublin working class areas. Places where all five Members of the Dáil campaigned for a "Yes" vote had a 68% "No" vote, including Dublin Central and Dublin South-West. There is a strong wish to have independent voices in the House.
I will be speaking in Belfast this evening. We found that Northern voters in the Seanad election were somewhat annoyed that they were about to be deprived of their vote for Leinster House and the Oireachtas in a referendum in which they had no vote, because the register used in the referendum was the Dáil register. I believe that is why the Donegal constituencies voted "No". The people there have strong connections with Northern Ireland. People in the North got their friends, relations, neighbours, people in the places where they spend their holidays and so on to vote "No". These were all important segments which, among others, wanted the House to be retained and developed.
We believe the Bill is constitutional. Article 18.1 states: "Seanad Éireann shall be composed of sixty members, of whom eleven shall be nominated members and forty-nine shall be elected members." Article 18.4.1° states:

i Three shall be elected by the National University of Ireland.
ii Three shall be elected by the University of Dublin.
iii Forty-three shall be elected from panels of candidates constituted as hereinafter provided.

Article 18.7.1° states "five panels of candidates shall be formed in the manner provided by law...". We provide by law for one of those panels which, we believe, could create the cultural and educational panel to which I have referred. The panels are listed in the article. Article 18.10.1° states "Subject to the foregoing provisions of this Article elections of the elected members of Seanad Éireann shall be regulated by law".
We hope the Bill we are proposing goes forward with the Bills proposed by the Government, Senator Crown and Senator Zappone. It should go for consideration as part of the overall package of reforming the House.
One difficulty we see with the proposals currently being examined in the franchise section of the Department is the creation of a constituency with up to 870,000 voters. This corresponds to the election of 40 Dáil Deputies. It would be an immense constituency. Our fear is that the independent voices - the young people who run for election who have recently graduated and so on - would be unable to face the expense of such a large constituency. For example, Carlow-Kilkenny has five seats for approximately 105,000 voters and, therefore, we estimate a 870,000-voter constituency would be of such a size as to elect 40 Dáil Deputies. We believe this will be a major deterrent.
If the political parties take over the two university constituencies, the great contribution that has been made since the beginning by the university seats will be lost. Let us consider the tradition of Mary Robinson and Owen Sheehy-Skeffington's opposition to corporal punishment in schools, as well as William Bedell Stanford's attempt to promote North-South trade in the 1940s when we had customs barriers and so on. The liberal agenda, personified by Senators David Norris, Mary Robinson and so on, will be lost. The essence of this House will be lost if the political parties take over this immense constituency. I cannot see many others being able to afford to run. The former Trinity College provost John Henry Bernard discussed this when he went to see Arthur Griffith in 1922 and it was agreed by Mr. de Valera in the 1937 Constitution. The liberal voice and the non-majoritarian voice has served this country well. It helps to maintain vital Northern Ireland links as we configure what Ireland will look like in future, as well as better relations between the two parts of Ireland. These are improving all the time. The loss of the two university constituencies would prove the case the Government was making in the October referendum in respect of the Seanad being composed of Fianna Fáil lite, Labour Party lite and Fine Gael lite. There would be no independent voice or unique role such as that played by those who have taken the university seats. If we allow that to happen I believe we would seriously damage the Seanad and not live up to the spirit and aspirations of the people, some 643,000 of whom endorsed the House last October.