Mary White (Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Minister of State very much for attending today. It is always a pleasure to listen to her. I compliment my colleagues who introduced the Bill.

I would like to address directly the issue of out-of-town retail areas and superstores, such as Lidl and Aldi, which are incentivising shoppers to shop out of town, in many cases with free car parking that is often on land on which rates do not have to be paid.

I probably have a more strident view than others on the state of many towns and villages around the country. The town centres are absolutely decimated. There are many derelict shops, houses and other buildings and a sense that towns are bordering on death. There is absolutely no question about it. The Minister of State's language is not firm enough. Circumstances in Limerick are probably different from elsewhere but there are many towns and villages around the country that have been totally decimated.

The town centres are gone. They are subject to pressure of high rates, an issue to which I will return later, and consumers are not spending. That is the tragedy. The Germany economy grew by only 0.4% last year. The growth came not through manufacturing but through consumers actually spending. Our consumers are not spending. They are buying more but they are not spending any more money and if they are spending it is very erratic. There is no consistent pattern of how they are spending as the level of spend is up one week and down the next week.

I have a problem, as I said many times previously, with the lack of commercial understanding by bureaucrats in local authorities who decide what the rates will be. They do not give a damn as to whether the retailers survive. Retailers can be found the length and breadth of the country in every town and village and provide employment nationally whereas the multinationals and the large companies are engaged in urban areas. I am very passionate about this issue. I co-hosted a conference led by Sir Terry Leahy, former chief executive of Tesco, on 12 December in Dundrum town centre. He spoke very passionately about the issue. The Government should keep its nose out of business and out of retailers' business as it does not have a clue how to do business. Having worked in the public sector for a number of years I am aware that the people there are-----