David Norris (Independent) | Oireachtas source

If it is agreeable to Senator O'Donovan, I would like to second his proposal for an amendment to the Order of Business. The fishing industry has over the entire period of my time in this House been treated with contempt. This is ridiculous and has been a very foolish strategy on the part of all Governments.

With regard to the Order of Business, I agree with Senator van Turnhout but I am even more outraged by the situation. It is not just a question of postponing legislation. It is the way this House is treated by the Government. Once again, we have no legislation, and the public sees this and the press may very well comment upon it when there are strange gaps. This is not the fault of the Leader. We had a leaders meeting this morning and it became absolutely clear it is because no Minister was available to take business in this House - not one single Minister.

I do not believe the Government has learned the lesson of the referendum. The people put us back here and they said they wanted us to do work. Some of us pointed out that we have worked very hard but we have been hindered continually by Government. This rotten, undemocratic practice is still continuing. We should not let this occasion go without letting the public know that this is the Government again deliberately obstructing the Seanad and treating it very much as a second-class House.

We spent some time yesterday talking about our allowances and I suggested getting rid of the whole damn lot and giving us a wage for the job, and let it be taxed and all the rest of it. That is what I think should happen. We are talking smallish amounts of money and we now discover that people who are in the public service on €200,000 plus are getting another €40,000 or €50,000 out of the sweet shop. I wonder how many other areas of public life this is happening in. We should look into this matter. In these times we need to look at everything that can be done to create a decent economy.

I would welcome a debate on the remarks of the North of Ireland Attorney General. It is an extremely difficult situation but at least he has the virtue of telling the truth and facing the facts. It is a huge ask for anybody who has been bereaved in the barbarous events that went on in Northern Ireland to draw a line under it and say we have to put that in the past. However, at some stage, that has to happen.

I think the Attorney General is quite wise and speaking appropriately when he points that, because of the time lapse, it is very difficult to get a conviction, and that because of certain agreements that were made, issues were fudged. For example, when the disarmament of the IRA happened, and it destroyed its weapons and explosives, it was part of the agreement that no forensic tests were done on any of that weaponry, so a huge body of evidence was destroyed which could have been crucial in these matters. Again, in regard to those people who have been disappeared - what a horrible word and what a reproach to our country that it should happen in this country to people like Jean McConville, who were taken out and savagely murdered - when their families look for their bodies, there is an agreement that there will be no inquest, no autopsy and no forensic report. There is a complete absence of evidence in many of these cases.

I believe we should have such a debate. It is an enormous amount to ask and I am not sure how many of us would be prepared to take that, but it would be such a step forward. On the other hand, however, we must continue to demand that the bodies of those who have been murdered and disappeared should be recovered. I believe the Attorney General of Northern Ireland, Mr. John Larkin, made a series of extremely good, logical points. We have to try to assuage the natural emotion of other people but that, in my opinion, is the way forward.