Sean Barrett (Independent) | Oireachtas source

I join the Leader and others in welcoming Mr. David Begg. It is a reunion, in a sense, because for several years on Friday mornings we heard the thoughts of Mr. Begg at the National Economic and Social Council, NESC. They were always carefully prepared and forcefully argued proposals for economic improvement. The tutorial has resumed, updated from the period when I left the NESC. At that time, Mr. Begg would make a presentation and I would come in soon afterwards. After that, each Department representative defended his or her Department and would not discuss the ideas we had. Add to that the rigid Whip system here, and we have the great Keynes quote that Mr. Begg and I use frequently: "It is ideas, not vested interests, which are dangerous for good or evil." Mr. Begg and I aired ideas at the NESC and it stopped there. The rest of the system was geared to prevent them from going further. I came here with Keynesian objectives in mind and they were stopped. People from Department X did not want to comment on whatever we had to say on Department Y. Presumably, there were repercussions when they went back. People come to me outside the Chamber and tell me they fully support me but when it comes to debating in the Chamber it is gone because Mr. Whippy has intervened and Members must do what they are told. We need ideas and I always admired the way Mr. David Begg introduced them. We try to do the same here. The Nevin Economic Research Institute, NERI, is an important development in that regard.

Mr. Begg and Senator Bacik referred to social partnership running out of steam in 2009. Was it hijacked? Under the idea of being too big to fail, we invented a form of socialism for the rich and bailed out, at vast expense, the bankers and the accountants who prepared accounts that were not a true and accurate reflection of the companies upon which they were reporting. There were disastrous failures in central banking. It was supposed to be a regulated sector but the ideas were kept out.

One of the ideas of NERI and in the thinking of Mr. Begg, which we need at this stage, is that we have all seen the consequences of the 2008 collapse but we now need to look at the causes. When union representatives appeared before the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, I mentioned that with the experience, expertise and knowledge they have, we must consider what kind of banks we should have. The existing banks would do the same all over again, which would cost us another €64 billion. Mr. Begg and NERI could develop these ideas. Why do we not have proper project appraisal and policy evaluation in the public sector? How do we get a proper banking system that will not put the country back on the rocks, leading to the unemployment to which Mr. Begg referred?

It will not be so momentous an event when we leave the troika because we still have a bundle of debt. We need to have a kind of economic policy to deal with the post-collapse society. What institutions and regulation of institutions do we need to restore the progress we all want? In the context of thinking out policy, Mr. Begg and I were members of the NESC after we sleepwalked into the euro. Mr. Begg mentioned globalisation, and people are seriously concerned about how to protect a small country such as Ireland from a tsunami of capital that leads to property bubbles. We had a system that gave no power to devalue, no control over interest rates, no bank regulation, no exit mechanism, not enough fiscal federalism and no anti-tsunami measures for capital flows. It is interesting how countries like Germany and Canada have managed to survive this and have not gone down the route of debt that has befallen us. Perhaps the emphasis in this House and in public discourse should be on how to repair institutions. We have spent a lot of time and money trying to deal with the consequences.

I liked the references from the 1913 period to the solidarity we tried to achieve between working class people in Belfast and in Dublin. One of Mr. Begg's predecessors in Northern Ireland, Mr. Terry Carlin, did magnificent work at the worst times of the Troubles in trying to keep the workers together and not split along sectarian lines. I like the idea that institutions are vital to society and should not be dispensed with lightly. Obviously this refers to what we are speaking about now. Institutions are important and should redefine themselves and continue the flow of ideas.

The Irish Congress of Trade Unions is a nominating body for the Seanad. Can we expect to see Mr. Begg on these benches introducing his ideas every day rather than on occasional visits? I would welcome that because I always find what he has to say of the greatest interest and stimulation.

Notwithstanding his appalling industrial relations image, Mr. William Martin Murphy was an entrepreneur of a kind and was widely admired in transport circles for the tram system he ran. Maybe we need to find more entrepreneurs, as we are always trying to do in industrial policy. There may be redeeming features that have not yet drawn much attention in the events of 100 years ago.

Mr. Begg's words were a masterful discourse of then and now, ending with blood and tears in Flanders for so many people. Let us hope we do not do that again. The revolt in the UK and US Parliaments stopped precipitous wars like the one in which so many trade union members died in 1914. Public policy goes on, and the contributions to discourse Mr. Begg has brought today and always brings are most valuable and are part of the ambition of civic society. I thank the Leader and the Cathaoirleach for inviting him and I thank Mr. Begg for his address.